Tuesday, July 17, 2007

Intel Core 2 servers are literally hot

Even Anand had to admit Intel servers are burning lots of watts. A 2.3GHZ Woodcrest server consumes 260 watts at idle. A 2.6GHZ Opteron server only consumes 160 watts. Intel dual core servers consume 60% more power than AMD. In benchmarks, we see the same thing, a 2.3GHZ Woodcrest generates more heat than a 2.6GHZ Opteron made on 90nm.

I told you long time ago. Core 2 architecture is a scam. You can see from the benchmarks, Intel has no advantage in performance, it only generates more heat.

63 Comments:

Blogger Scientia from AMDZone said...

Oh, I just referenced this same comparison in the last thread. It should be mentioned that this is for dual socket systems where Intel has problems with FBDIMM. Intel would do better with single socket systems. Also, I wouldn't describe the Intel servers as "hot"; AMD has a small performance/watt lead. ASAP is a good general purpose benchmark for servers but Intel should be ahead with renderfarms or HPC systems where SSE performance is needed.

8:49 AM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Frank said...

That's too bad for AMD. Intel is going to continue the path of mega memory capacity for those that need it, offering something that AMD doesn't, while also whacking some chunks of power caused by the FBD. On top of a non-FBD platform, AMD will feel the wrath of 50W 2.66GHz quads with 12MB L2 and SSE4 compared to their own measly hot 68W 1.9GHz.

9:01 AM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Frank said...

Intel's performance advantage is profound in workstation. To imply worse server performance, well... When AMD was leading, they boasted about TPC-C, SAP-SD, SPECjbb. Now, they chip and chop, excluding industry standard benchmarks, ignoring the significance of Clovertown, while Intel is ruling the roost. Sure they use a few outdated benches here and there (surely updated once Harpertown comes), but if you couldn't figure why AMD is getting whooped most in servers, you should now;)

9:22 AM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger bgt said...

my 6300 is also a lot hotter than my 5000+ when I do multiple tasks like quickpar, extracting an ISO and doing a rar at the same time. The Intel 6300 reaches 65C quickly as the 5000+ wont go over 50C.
Also the 6300 freezes at a certain time.

10:20 AM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger mishan said...

My 6000+ blew up the moment I installed it. Undocumented, 100% verifiable, anecdotal evidence here.

10:33 AM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Rodney said...

That's quite a story, Enrique. I like stories. I like stories about pinatas. In fact, I like everything you have to say.

11:04 AM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger slack_comp_user said...

Scientia from AMDZone said...
It should be mentioned that this is for dual socket systems where Intel has problems with FBDIMM.


I knew that FBDIMMs used more power but I was a little gobsmacked with how much more.

I tried to work out the benefits of FBDIMMs :-

pros: simplified board design, higher capacity & performance, higher reliability

cons: higher power consumption, latency, cost and heat dissipation

Have I listed them correctly or missed anything ?etiee

11:28 AM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

I agree Intel cpu's are "hot".

In about an hour and a half we will see jusy how hot they have been selling.

What do you think doc, will Intel profit be equal to AMD revenue? How much more market share will Intel have taken from AMD?

12:06 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

bgt
"my 6300 is also a lot hotter than my 5000+"

Heat!=power usage


slack_comp_user
"I knew that FBDIMMs used more power but I was a little gobsmacked with how much more."

There are low-power FBDIMMs that do not take much more power than DDR2.

You got the things pretty nicely summed up

12:09 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

There you go Doc, net earnings up 44% YOY to $1.3B.

Any AMD can feel free to chime in on how much money they think AMD will be earning.

1:30 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

Is this article about earnings or heat issues???

1:47 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Wow... 44% increase in profits from last year, and Intel is shipping more units (meaning more marketshare too).

The only bad news is that memory chips for mobile phones didn't sell too well. Now Sharikou and oneexpert, I know this will come as a shock to you, but memory chips for mobile phones have nothing to do with the K10... really they don't.

So yeah... Intel stuff does sell really hot there ya go!

2:04 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Hornet331 said...

@ only amd

well kinda, why would intel make more profit, when that "heat" issues are so serious ?

2:05 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

Okay, we can talk about heat.

Here's AMD's idea of a quad core system, all 450 watts of it.

http://techreport.com/reviews/2006q4/quad-fx/index.x?pg=13

AMD should get into the blow dryer business, they certainly have the power consumption for it.


After tomorrow's earnings report, AMD's investors also will wish they would get into another busniess.

2:10 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Hey Sharikou, Intel posts year over year revenue and profit growth. 8.7bn revenue, 1.35bn profit.

Sharikou are you going to make an estimate on how much money AMD will make this quarter?

I'll help you out. This time last year (Q2'06 results) AMD made $1.22bn revenue. They had a profit of $102m. Ati had revenue of $672m and a profit of $34.1m. Total revenue was $1.894bn with a total profit of $136.1m. We will see on Thursday how well AMD did this quarter.



my 6300 is also a lot hotter than my 5000+ when I do multiple tasks like quickpar, extracting an ISO and doing a rar at the same time. The Intel 6300 reaches 65C quickly as the 5000+ wont go over 50C.
Also the 6300 freezes at a certain time.


Are you using the stock Intel fan there? The fans are a bit tricky, you need to be sure all four push pins are properly pushed in. It's easy to overlook this. Intel really does need to come up with a better installation system for it's stock fans next time around.

4:38 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...


AMD should get into the blow dryer business, they certainly have the power consumption for it.


It's the middle of winter here. It's freezing cold. Perhaps I should sell my two Core 2 systems and build a 4x4 system to keep my whole house warm. :-P

I'm listening to the Intel Q2'07 earnings webcast now and taking notes of anything interesting.

So far:

-Inventory was down by ~8 days from Q1'07

-Intel predicts revenue growth of 6% YoY for Q3.

Damn. How did Intel get themselves in such a fine mess?! They will go BK in Q2'08 for sure!

Meanwhile, over at AMD, losing in excess of $500m a quarter is fine. It's business as usual at AMD. No problems at all.

5:19 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

6:53 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

I know this is off base but my turn to stroke the old fire some..

EU comments:

The process can take years, but if the regulator concludes that Intel has abused its dominant position in the market it could be fined up to 10% of its global annual sales.

Japanese competition officials declared that Intel's rebate schemes are illegal in 2005. Intel is appealing that finding.

AMD has filed an antitrust case against Intel in a US federal court, which is still pending.


Meanwhile, South Korea is also investigating Intel's practices.

7:06 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger oneexpert said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

7:46 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Hey onemoron, AMD processors seem to be so great. How much money is AMD going to have made selling them in Q2'07?

8:03 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger oneexpert said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

8:45 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger rathor said...

I'm an AMD fan but I also got home a C2D E6300 oc. to 2.89 GHz. The other system is a X2 3800+ oc. 2.67 GHz... So, let's make it clear:

Max temp. in full load (Orthos):

C2D : 63-65
X2 : 53-56

Max temp in idle:

C2D : 45
X2 : 38

PS: Both system have Arctic Cooling Fans (7 Pro and 64 Pro), both systems have the same config. (except mb).

Peace ;)

10:39 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger AndyW35 said...

One of my memory modules failed last night, perhaps I should have gone FBDIMM or not run 2.2v through it :). Although cpu voltages are coming down the DDR2 memory, which is supposed to be 1.8v standard, is constantly being advertised as 2V +, at least the fast stuff is. Not sure statistically what that is doing for longevity but it surely cannot be helping the overall power use.I see fast 1.5v DDR3 being set to perform at 1.8V also.

I am just talking from a homeuser perspective here of course, someone who overclocks a bit as well. Not really the standard user I guess.

Intels figures are Ok, not sure how they can say the margins will improve for Q3 if they are cutting prices massively on 22nd July and 45nm is not out yet. Maybe they are using cheaper sand ? :)

As K10 is not going to be out in quantity to Q4 you would think their profit will still be healthy for Q3 and Q4 so that only leaves 6 months for them to then lose all their money and go bankrupt onSharikou's Big Day !

10:57 PM, July 17, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

Hey Doc, Intel's cash on hand increased to $10.2B.

When is that BK again?

8:22 AM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger oneexpert said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

9:00 AM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Intel shipped record numbers of mobile and server CPUs. Clearly, no one wants AMD's garbage CPUs. Intel controls 100% of the desktop market above $200 price.

9:08 AM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Hey Oneexpert, the only reason people are buying AMD is because they think it will get bought-out and their investment will be worth something then. Those investors are effectively making Vegas bets when it comes to AMD.

I got a question for you: If Intel was 'hurt' (oh yeah.. a 44% increase in profit is just so terrible) by the price-war... do you think AMD will even be able to stay in business if it keeps going? AMD reports its quarterly losses after markets close on Thursday, if you are such an 'expert' on these things, tell us how much AMD is going to lose? Even your pals at Fudzilla are estimating 540-570 million, and for once I think they are in the right neigborhood.

9:59 AM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger yomamafor2 said...

rathor
I'm an AMD fan but I also got home a C2D E6300 oc. to 2.89 GHz. The other system is a X2 3800+ oc. 2.67 GHz... So, let's make it clear:

Max temp. in full load (Orthos):

C2D : 63-65
X2 : 53-56

Max temp in idle:

C2D : 45
X2 : 38

PS: Both system have Arctic Cooling Fans (7 Pro and 64 Pro), both systems have the same config. (except mb).

Peace ;)


...and you want to use that to prove Intel's CPUs runs hotter at max load?

Two computers, with different configuration, with different OC, and you want to compare them? Its just like THG's energy consumption article that compares Sempron 3400+ with C2D E6600.

11:04 AM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger yomamafor2 said...

so Doc, do you still stand firm on your "Intel BK Q208" stance? It really looks like you're getting softer and softer on that. Maybe a change of mind?

11:13 AM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

yamamofor2
"Two computers, with different configuration, with different OC, and you want to compare them?"

Yeah, I think I should measure the power usage of my E4300@2.8GHz with lower than default voltage. This should give some interesting things to talk about :)

11:30 AM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger core2dude said...

I have Core 2 Duo E6700 B step, overclocked to 3.2GHz at 1.25 v (slight undervolt). Idle temperature is about 41 deg C, Full load is 49 deg C.

I never increase the voltage to achieve the overclock. Whatever I get at default voltage is what I use.

11:41 AM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger core2dude said...

Oh! And this baby can encode a 1 hour DVD using Adobe Premiere Elements in about 22 to 25 minutes, while staying below 50 deg C!

Beat that!

11:42 AM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

onemoron,
Did you fail to notice that fall AMD is taking in it's stock price? How do you think AMD will look on Friday?

Let's look at UTX. They beat all estimates, increased their yearly projections, and still are down by more than 2% today. What's your explanation for that?


Do you have any clue at all how financial markets operate?

How much market share do you think Intel took from AMD the old, hot pentium 3's?

I'm betting you don't have the balls to answer these questions.

12:28 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

THINK GREEN !!!!!


NOT BLUE!!!!

2:44 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger yomamafor2 said...

only amd
THINK GREEN !!!!!


NOT BLUE!!!!
'

that is the most convincing argument i've seen in ages. Now because of that, I'm going out to buy AMD CPUs.

3:04 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

... and I'll go buy myself a 8800GTS


Of cource if you really want to save the planet then don't upgrade your PC. Ever. No component will ever use as much power as was used to make it.

3:08 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger ii said...

Why think green like baby doodoo when you can be blue into the heavens?

3:28 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger Mo said...

Shakira hasn't posted in the comments for a long time now.

I wonder why haha.

5:44 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger BONER said...

For what it's worth I do phone tech support and about a month ago an AMD engineer called in for help and during our conversation I asked him if he was familiar with the sharikou blog. I was surprised to find out he was aware of this blog and he mentioned how his colleagues and him thought sharikou is, and I quote, "retarded." He went on to tell me (paraphrasing) that the Intel BK predictions are ridiculous.

7:17 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger oneexpert said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

8:23 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

Intel net income up by 44% year to year, profit down by 57%



The reason;

10,500 employees dismissed over 1 yr. Sooo the added savings from employee firings had to of played a part in this ..not the sale of cpus.... Not a financial guru but i can read...

8:35 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger slack_comp_user said...

Only AMD said...
"Intel net income up by 44% year to year, profit down by 57%"


I'm a little confused how can net income be up 44% YoY and profit be down 57% ?

Isn't net income the income after taking costs / expensives away from revenue i.e. profit ?

Also the only mention of profit been down 57% I can find is when Intel announced net income fell 57 percent to $885 million for the second quarter 2006.

9:38 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

only_amd is a moron. Intel's profit is up 44% YoY.

AMD will not make any profit. AMD is losing all their money. They will BK in Q2'08.

10:20 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger Hornet331 said...

Only AMD said...
Intel net income up by 44% year to year, profit down by 57%



The reason;

10,500 employees dismissed over 1 yr. Sooo the added savings from employee firings had to of played a part in this ..not the sale of cpus.... Not a financial guru but i can read...


wow i didnt know the avarage intel employee got 54k a year..... no wonder they had to lay of some people...

11:35 PM, July 18, 2007  
Blogger yomamafor2 said...

only amd
Intel net income up by 44% year to year, profit down by 57%
The reason;

10,500 employees dismissed over 1 yr. Sooo the added savings from employee firings had to of played a part in this ..not the sale of cpus.... Not a financial guru but i can read...


wow.. straight FUD and BS.

Intel's Q2 net income is 26% higher than a year before, with 44% higher profit. The price war does take a toll on Intel, as net income dropped 19%, and profit dropped 22% compared to Q1 07.

http://www.dailytech.com/Intel+Records+Q2+Revenue+of+87+Billion+USD/article8094.htm

I'm not sure the firing of 10k employees that you claimed is right or not. However, since your assumption is completely off, I would think that you pulled that from your arse too.

12:16 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger yomamafor2 said...

I seem to notice a trend here. Those who supports AMD will usually leave a comment (most of the time an inflammatory, yet meaningless one), and just left without defending their point of view (with the exception of some).

Maybe they've all learned from their Sharidouche master, to post and run?

12:18 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Randy Allen said...

Barcelona benchmarked and demonstrated: http://virtualexperience.amd.com/index.html?cid=quadcore&co=quadcore

Intel is finished.

1:09 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

Where? All I saw was more marketing talk and no numbers. I also saw the "moid 2007 availiability" claim. They strech the mid-year to way longer than I've ever seen before.

3:06 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

I was right, oneretard doesn't have the balls.

5:00 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

As i stated I'm no financial guru..but i understand compensation packages that any company pays its employees.

1-Workmans Comp
2-Half of your SS payment
3-Insurance maybe co-pay
4-Profit Sharing
5-401K

Buy out packages are cheaper then saving jobs for corporations. We're speaking of the bottom line here nothing to do with competition. That is my answer to all the arse's!!!

9:49 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Mo said...

ONLY AMD should save the embarrassment and never post here again. He will just be laughed at as usual.

Net Income = Profit

You're still living in Q2, 2006 lol.

Dude seriously, don't reply to this blog, you look dumber every time you open your mouth.

9:51 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

To all who didn't understand the
Financial news..The Link or more if you need them.

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/
story/intels-profit-up-44-stock/
story.aspx?guid=%

9:53 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

@ Mo

Like wise to you!!!

9:56 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Lou Ceifer said...

"I seem to notice a trend here. Those who supports AMD will usually leave a comment (most of the time an inflammatory, yet meaningless one), and just left without defending their point of view (with the exception of some).

Maybe they've all learned from their Sharidouche master, to post and run?"


Nope. Most AMD supporters that used to post actual, relevant and intelligent comments here(like myself) have finally learned debating intelligently with fanatical idiots like the majority of rabid Intel zealots here is pointless, worthless and most of all, a complete waste of time and have moved on to other sites. I guess most Intel zealots took Intel being surpassed by AMD for 3 years quite personally and now they are exacting "revenge", which I find quite laughable. Those Intel zealots believe thier viewpoint is that everyone else is wrong and only they are right, facts and truth be damned.(and yes, I have seen a few AMD fanboys just like this too FYI!) Just about every story, news article or blog post is twisted into some form or fashion to enforce or advance thier agenda to their own beliefs or viewpoints to the point it's hilarious, but then I realize just how sad it really is. The parallels I see to this kind behavior and Nazi SS brainwashing tactics, Russian KGB "misinformation" methods and radical Islamic teachings or "programming" is very eeriely familiar and scary. Seriously, some of you people really need to read some of the stuff you write from time to time, compare it to the above mentioned thought control methods/misinformation/programming tactics and get some perspective of just how damn crazy some of you sound, whether it's a joke to you or not. 1984 anyone? Orwell anybody?

There are few AMD fans here that either enjoy this kind of sadomasist bullcrap or are just that determined about what they believe. Me, personally, I find this a futile excercise in how to really waste time and lose IQ points in the process. So instead, I personally find far more intelligent comments and info on Scientia's blog since it seems Sharikou is merely trolling for venom from the Intel fanboys he seems to attract in the droves with his blog posts here nowadays.

So in closing, enjoy your Intel circle jerks boys, I for one am deleting this blog link off the browser. Stupid is as stupid does I guess, it doesn't really matter who is more stupid in the end. You all lose. However, I guess you people and Sharikou deserve each other, in some kind of pathetic, sadisitic, symbotic existance.

10:03 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Hornet331 said...

lol @ comparing fanboyism with nazi, soviet, islamic propaganda...

ah damit, i just love this blog, it allways gives me stuff to laught at. :)

10:31 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

This has alwasys been one of my favorite quotes from Calvin Coolidge & this applies to the Intel posters in this blog.

“Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan "press on" has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race”

Got it "EDUCATED DERELICKS"!

10:31 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

See ya Lou!

It's been fun.

10:39 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

lou ceifer
"The parallels I see to this kind behavior and Nazi SS brainwashing tactics, Russian KGB "misinformation" methods and radical Islamic teachings or "programming" is very eeriely familiar and scary."

You forgot the brainwashing US is doing to its citizens, not to mention what Sharikou with a few fellow bloggers are trying to do ;)

10:51 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

This is where the language & bashing begun to get out of hand in this blog..Or maybe even earlier.

"K10 is coming to town"

No one to blame but the authors of each post!!!

11:12 AM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

lou is a pussy and can't handle the truth.

Don't let the fact door hit you in the ass on the way out...


Oh wait, you are an AMD fanboi, the fact door has been beating you senseless for the past 16 months.

Now if we can only get the rest of the douchebags to shut the fuck up.

1:34 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger lex said...

Yo "Ph"ony "D"octorate

You got the headline right

" Intel Core 2 servers are literally hot"

Everyone wants one so bad and could care less about AMD's garbage that AMD is losing what 600 million again. BK in 2008 I say.

Heah where is Barcelona, where is Phenom on that advance SOI 65nm process with APM that helps yield and speed.. I guess the 65nm SOI and APM aren't what you think they are... or is Barcelona the K9 dog that it really is?

4:40 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

@hornet & others

Straight out of the mouth of Intel


The average annual wage at the Intel plant in Rio Rancho is $46,000, nearly double the average state wage of $25,000. The starting salary at Intel is $36,000, but company spokesman Terry McDermott says that most employees make a lot more than that simply by working overtime and weekend shifts.

Now who's the arse about the 10,000 being added to the bottom line as PROFIT!!!!!

8:33 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

So Intel pays it's employees well. What is wrong with that?

Fact: Intel is still very profitable.

Fact: AMD is not at all profitable and bleeding a LOT of cash.

11:30 PM, July 20, 2007  

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