Thursday, July 19, 2007

AMD grows units by 38% in 2Q07

AMD result is out. AMDers should cheer about the massive growth. It seems ATI is dragging a bit, but it's a temporary pain AMD must endure.

AMD's market share was 18.7% in 1Q07, 38% sequential unit growth should put AMD at about 26% . In other words, Intel market share is about 70%.

All AMD needs to do is keep pumping out those $70 dual core CPUs.

One interesting thing is AMD gained in server ASP. This is because Intel is now purely a low end 2P server chip vendor. AMD must be selling a lot of 8-way Opterons. With quad-core Opterons soon available, Intel's server performance will be pitiful. AMD will have 8P quad-core servers, total 32 K10 cores. Intel, on the other hand, is limited to 2P Clovertown, total 8 cores.

Intel's server performance will be less than 20% of AMD's.

145 Comments:

Blogger Chuckula said...

Sharikou, you lying, spinning sack of SHIT.

Intel: 44% Higher profits, more marketshare, and all you can say is that they are somehow about to go BK because.... um..... Hector Ruiz said so after he ate those shrooms??


AMD: Muthafuckas lost $600MILLION in 1 quarter, (that's $1.09/share, hell even the pro-AMD analysts who are hoping for a buyout were only predicting $0.85/share).

Let me ask you something Sharikou, if Intel is being 'destroyed' by only having a 46% gross margin, then what the fuck is AMD going to do? This may come as a shock but you can't just go on losing money forever. This quarter has been an unmitigated trainwreck for AMD, and the fact they managed to ship more chips (by giving them away at a loss.... hey isn't that called 'dumping' and is considered an illegal monopolistic practice???) is 100% irrelevant.

2:24 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Let me add onto my previous statement with a quote from the Inquirer (hardly a pro-Intel racket):

CHIP FIRM AMD made a net loss of $600 millon in its latest Q2 financial quarter.

It also dumped $30 mills worth of old chips it couldn't sell, in the quarter, confirming what Intel CEO Paul Otellini said two days ago about stuff swilling about in the channel.


Dumping chips... that's one way to increase shipments.
Read the rest right here.

2:47 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Oh and one last point Sharikou & one_retard:
AMD's revenue went up, but remember morons, last year at this time ATI was a semi-successful independent graphics company whose revenue didn't count for AMD's top-line. Now ATI is a struggling division wthin AMD.
So before you get all pumped up about a somewhat higher revenue number remember:
1. This was a great 2Q and AMD still managed to lose more money than expected.
2. The revenue from this 2Q is ATI + AMD together, whereas last year it was AMD alone... so it's not really anything to cheer about.
3. If Intel is crying about only having 46% gross margins, and AMD is dumping chips, you are in a hell of a lot of trouble, no screaming or denial by Sharikou or one-retard is going to change facts.

3:00 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

In fact, I'll even back-up my correct assertions with real numbers from AMD's own website:

Check out the 2006 results for the 2nd quarter from ATI:
right here (pdf file)

Note at the very top: ATI had $672 million in revenue in Q2 of 2006, yay!

OK, AMD itself had $1.22 billion in revenue in Q2 2006, and it even made a profit.

So, assuming exactly 0 revenue growth, you would have expected AMD + ATI to have made $1.22 billion + $0.672 billion = about $1.89 Billion in revenue. And when you factor in the strong 2Q everyone had, you'd expect it to be BETTER than that!!

So Sharikou, how the fuck is revenue of $1.38 billion somehow magically great when the 2 companies made about $500 million more last year in the same quarter? Can you explain that or will you just start lying again? Hey oneretard, can you make up a new meaningless slogan to chant instead of actually talking about facts? Try not to make it as stupid as your other ones, I want entertainment out of you lunatics because you sure as hell are too stupid to have a real discussion with.

3:09 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Mo said...

Chuckula,
How dare you question Sharikou's numbers? I ask, HOW DARE YOU? They are possibly even more accurate than the numbers AMD got themselves.

Thank you o' great sharikou of enlightening us.

3:44 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger core2dude said...


Chuckula,
How dare you question Sharikou's numbers? I ask, HOW DARE YOU? They are possibly even more accurate than the numbers AMD got themselves.


Forget about Sharikou. I was really frustrated to see that press was reporting that AMD revenue soared! No it didn't! It in fact went down.

4:01 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

Once again Sharidouche proves he is indeed the worlds largest fuckwit.

AMD lost $600 MILLION dollars this Q.


AMD tossed out $30 MILLION dollars in hardware it couldn't sell.

I think all this time Sharidouche has been blabbering Intel is going BK in Q208, he meant AMD the whole time.

4:08 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

One thing I fucking love about Sharidouche is the fact when Intel reduces prices on it's CPU's its dumping them, or blah blah blah... but when AMD does it, its the road to salvation!

You know what? Intel can afford to sell $70 chips. AMD can't.

Someone, some day is going to find Shiradouche dead in his bedroom, an AMD plastic bag tied around his neck and his hand on his cock, fake benchmarks on his computer monitor. REmember Ph(ake)d, auto-erotic asphyxiation needs to be done more carefully... your fantasy world may infact, someday kill you

4:11 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger lex said...

Sharikou Phd you again prove to all that you are a "Ph"ony "D"octorate.

You are a lier who can't even digest a simple financial report and tell the difference between profit and loss.

YOu must be the silly assistant to Hector. As since you started advising him AMD has successfuly made every wrong move possible.

Keep up the good work! INTEL stock is up and AMD is going BK

4:37 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger oneexpert said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

4:58 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Chris said...

Pho-Dr. Stange you represent what is bad on the internet.

You are a complete and total moron of the greatest degree.

I think they should enact a law where ignots like you are castrated so as not to bring more ignots into this world.

If a law is created they should call it the "Sharikou protection act" as in protecting the rest of us from the likes of anything remotely related to someone so completely clueless.

5:23 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Chris said...

"Someone, some day is going to find Shiradouche dead in his bedroom, an AMD plastic bag tied around his neck and his hand on his cock, fake benchmarks on his computer monitor. REmember Ph(ake)d, auto-erotic asphyxiation needs to be done more carefully... your fantasy world may infact, someday kill you"

Merlin thanks much. I laughed so hard I cried....ahh that maid my day...right down to the fake bechmarks on the monitor..DAM THAT WAS FUNNY!!!

5:28 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Roborat, Ph. D. said...

Intel's server performance will be less than 20% of AMD's.

i think you're starting to break away from the AMD teachings. AMD is no longer interested in performance. their customers only wants value. "performance" was not even once used to describe AMD's products since 2006.

6:09 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Mahboobul said...

Don't be so cruel to Sharikou. His statements about Intel's BK are preposterous. The market will let us know how it is interpreting AMD's number tomorrow and in next few days.

6:10 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

WOW...$5.3B in debt.

Another loss of $600M

Another 500 employees losing their jobs.

Forget Q2, AMD may be BK in Q1.

6:30 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Yeah. $1.3bn in profit is really bad. Intel is in big trouble now. BK in 2008!

AMD is on the right path, posting $600m losses and building more debt and writing off inventory that they can't sell is the way to do it!

6:50 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

AMD has only $1.594 billion in cash left. That's three more quarters of losses in excess of $500m and then it's BK in Q1'08 for AMD.

AMD also has $5.3bn in debt now, up sharply for $3.6bn in Q1'07.

AMD BK Q1'08.

7:28 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

8:47 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

With quad-core Tigerton Xeons soon available, AMD's server performance will be pitiful. Intel will have 32P quad-core servers, total 128 Tigerton cores. AMD, on the other hand, is limited to 8P Barcelona, total 32 cores at a pitiful 2Ghz clockspeed.

AMD's server performance will be less than 20% of Intel's.

8:48 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Jeach! said...

Giant said...
[...] and writing off inventory that they can't sell is the way to do it!


You know what is really funny? No, not chuckula's pre-thought death threats for which people with an IQ inferior to 10 actually laughs at.

The fact that Intel's inventories were in much larger quantities with a product that third-world countries don't even want to buy. But yet you don't see Intel writing off any of this stuff.

If analysts would get off their asses and actually worked for a living I'm sure they would find a shit load of stuff. For one, how does a company make a $1 Billion 'secret' payment to DELL without it showing up in the books?

Bubba said...
WOW...$5.3B in debt.


Most of that debt will be converted soon enough!

8:57 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Louis said...

Sharidouche wrote:
"All AMD needs to do is keep pumping out those $70 dual core CPUs."

That's a great strategy if you're a non-profit. However, AMD is in this to make money for their future growth (survival) and for their shareholders. Losing $600M in a single quarter and missing EPS (Loss per share actually) by over 10% is NOT going to get the job done. They can't pump out $70 dual core CPUs and make a profit so once again, Sharidouche shows what a fool he is. I do hope Hector takes advice from you Sharidouche, because it will mean AMD BK in Q2'08.

9:42 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Louis said...

Evil_merlin wrote:
"Someone, some day is going to find Shiradouche dead in his bedroom, an AMD plastic bag tied around his neck and his hand on his cock, fake benchmarks on his computer monitor. REmember Ph(ake)d, auto-erotic asphyxiation needs to be done more carefully... your fantasy world may infact, someday kill you"

I think I busted something while laughing at this line. This comment put imagery in my head that I shall not soon forget.

9:49 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

I love the AMD fanbois!

Intel does well and its a conspiracy!

Never mind AMD is getting closer and closer to being SIX BILLION dollars in debt.

SIX BILLION DOLLARS.

Yeah, and Intel is going BK in Q2 of 08.

9:52 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger AndyW35 said...

OneExpert wrote

"According to the stock market experts, AMD is now in a excellent position to overtake intel who is suffering from extreme loss of profitability due to mismanagement."

You have this with the quote from some source above but I actually think you came up with this, it's hard to tell as you do not split the quote from your own thoughts.

Can you link to which stock market experts are saying this?

As for the results the gross margin was up slightly which is pretty good but the latest price cuts have just kicked in so it will be interesting to see what the margins are like for Q3. It's not a terrible result but it's not a great result (obviously! :) ) and a lot of things will depend on K10 I think.

Outlook : Unsettled.

10:15 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger rathor said...

AMD BK in Q2 '08 !!!
Intel BK in Q2 '08 !!!

Who's left? Transmeta?

N0 one in going BK people, these are only speculations. Intel won't accept AMD's BK, because they need somebody to compete with. If AMD is no longer what Intel should do? Flood the market with ONLY Intel inside chips? This is not acceptable. So what if AMD is loosing money right now? It is normal for a company that bought ATI for about 5.4B. Let it be people. The sun will shine for AMD someday.

Peace

10:40 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Of course AMD will BK. It's inevitable. AMD will BK in early 2008. 1.5bn in cash left, and losing $600m a quarter. What does that tell you?

10:51 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger rathor said...

It tells me nothing... and numbers do change. Got it?

11:36 PM, July 19, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Why? Because your an AMD fanboy?

The results are clear. AMD only has cash left for three quarters. 1.5bn in cash, losing $600m a quarter. Morgan and Stanley are ruthless. They want their money back. AMD will have to cough up the cash soon.

AMD's BK is inevitable. Barcelona will not help AMD since Barcelona is coming only at 2Ghz. AMD needs 3Ghz to keep up with Intel.

R600 is prefragged just as Barcelona.

AMD BK 2008.

12:03 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

rathor
"numbers do change"

For almost a whole year noe they have constantly being getting worse for AMD.

Just a few months ago I was 100% certain AMD won't BK any time soon. Those last few months have made me doubt in that.

They need a miracle to get any kind of profitability before H2 08 and I can't see that coming. K10 is almost nice but there is no mass production and there won't be for quite some time.

As for ATI part of AMD, it had almost $200M revenue with over $50M loss. Seems as R600 isn't all that good money generator after all.

12:18 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger rathor said...

Empty words. AMD won't BK dreamer. And, yes I'm an AMD fanboy is there any Law to stop me? Any questions left?

12:47 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

rathor
"Any questions left?"

Just one:
What exactly keeps AMD from going BK? Remember that K10 won't ramp for quite some time. Original plan was Q1 08 but then they also said they'll release 2.3GHz in late Q2.

1:03 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Yes! AMD will not go BK because rathor says so. There is presented evidence that is very compelling.

This is not like Sharikou's comments that Intel will BK soon. Intel has plenty of cash in the bank and is making large profits every quarter.

The faster Barcelona variants coming in Q4 have to contend with Penryn at 3.16Ghz, not Clovertown. Intel is not giving AMD any breathing room. AMD needs Barcelona to launch at minimum of 2.3Ghz so they can get sales in before Penryn launches, but this isn't going to happen.

1:21 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger rathor said...

There is no need for evidence. AMD simply won't BK. I'm 99% sure ;)

1:30 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

rathor
"There is no need for evidence"

Judging how they spend their money they don't seem to think they would need that either. A bit less than $2B losses in short while and nearly $6B in debt. Byt hey, their losses were a bit less this quarter, almost a whole 2% or so compared to the last one. Surely there is no way in hell they could ever BK.

2:00 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Ycon said...

AMD BK 4Q07

4:53 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger AndyW35 said...

Here in the UK bankrupt is pretty bad but in the USA it seems to us over here you can have a "semi-bankruptcy" where you actually end up existing for years afterwards. Examples of this seem to be your airline industry. I'm not an expert on these matters but for you guys it seems a mere inconvenience, so for either Intel or AMD maybe it is not so bad.

Another scenario, and possibly worse, is that AMD is broken up after a private equity company buys it. I think that would be worse for we cpu buyers in the long run.

6:40 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

Someone, some day is going to find Shiradouche dead in his bedroom, an AMD plastic bag tied around his neck and his hand on his cock, fake benchmarks on his computer monitor.

Best comment on this blog *ever*

7:28 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

These tests can't be disputed.

http://www.worlds-fastest.com/
wfz993.html

9:18 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

Only AMD,
Did you bother listening to conference call? Did you miss the part when AMD admitted they do not and will not have the top performing parts?

9:25 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

I love AMD fanbois.

When you can't win performance, you go the power route!

As I said before, AMD, the platform of choice when you don't wanna do anything.

Nice goal post moving fuckwits.

9:28 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger rathor said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

9:49 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger rathor said...

Intel = InHell

10:05 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

Intel = InHell

Oooh, witty and original......Not.

10:32 AM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Louis said...

"Comment deleted
This post has been removed by the author.

9:49 AM, July 20, 2007"

Given the comment that Evil_merlin made about Sharidouche dying from auto-erotic asphyxiation, it makes me wonder what some people are writing that would make Sharidouche delete the comment? Maybe they are posting proof of his fake PhD??? What could be worse that Sharidouche doesn't want posted on his blog?

12:25 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

"comment deleted" means that the author of the comment deleted it. When the owner of the blog erases something there won't be any signs of it.

Does anyone else miss the nice timetables Sharikou used to make that showed exactly what will happen with Intel in coming quarters and how will it eventually lead to BK?

12:43 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

Yeah I do.
If I was actually motivated I would go back and repost them for him.

But if I remember, wasn't Intel going to start posting "massive losses" in Q3 2006?

1:23 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

Ahhhh..Here we go.

2Q06: 40% price drop, 20% volume drop, impairment on goodwill, one time charges for massive 16,000 layoff. GAAP loss in the bag. Expect Intel to warn soon. Currently, Wall Street expects Intel to earn $0.15 per share. Expect ($0.05) loss at minimum.

3Q06: Conroe ramps to 10%. 20% additional price drop of P4, mobile CPU price crash, 10% additional volume drop. Operating loss expected. Plus more impairment on goodwill, plus one time charge on inventory write off.

4Q06: Conroe ramps to 20%. Merom ramps to 10%. Further reduction of P4 and Core Duo price. Revenue flat from 3Q06 in a seasonally up quarter. Operating loss. AMD exit 2006 with 40% market share (run rate).

1Q07: Conroe ramps to 35% of desktop units. Revenue down more than seasonal as AMD's 65nm parts flood the market.

2Q07: Intel server market share drops to 40% as AMD ramps Rev H quadcore. Bulldozer hits hard.

3Q07: AMD FAB36 ramps to 20,000wspm at 65nm. FAB38 ramps. Chartered FAB7 ramps. AMD grabs >50% of market share.

1:31 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

Bubba, so what that means in a nut shell is Shariadouche is hitting 0%...

4:47 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger core2dude said...

AMD's inventory is $892M. Adding those 33% margins back, this results in goods worth roughly $1.2B! That is about 85% of their expeted revenue next quarter. And this is just the inventory at their end. Inq reported that they have inventory build up in the channel as well. So, that begs the question, how the heck is AMD going to sell anything new that they are making, without writing off a large chunk of this inventory.

In other words, Hector and his stalwarts are cooking books. There is no way AMD is going to be able to sell this inventory, and at some point, not so distant in the future, they have to take a hit for it. But they are carrying the inventory to make the numbers look good.

4:58 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger core2dude said...

Just to show the bias of the media, when Intel had an inventory of about 50% of their quarterly revenue, the media was making a huge deal out of it. AMD's inventory after the 30 mil write off is about 65% to 70% of their quarterly revenue. And no one is saying a word about it...

5:00 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger pointer said...

Oh no, Energy star has come out with a wrong list. http://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm?fuseaction=find_a_product.showProductGroup&pgw_code=CO

only 5 AMD system in this 122 computer list. This must be a mistake. May be Sharikou and Oneexpert should write an email to EnergyStar to correct them!!! How dare they put 114 intel system into the list! They must be Intel paid pumper.

just for fun :)

6:51 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

I've seen some people reporting that Samsung might buy AMD. These reports are laughably wrong. I invite you to read the x86 licence agreement between AMD and Intel:-

http://contracts.corporate.findlaw.com/agreements/amd/intel.license.2001.01.01.html

Go to part 6, section 6.2 Termination for Cause.

It lists that the license will be terminated if:

(1) the filing by the other party of a petition in
bankruptcy or insolvency;

(2) any adjudication that the other party is bankrupt or
insolvent;

(3) the filing by the other party of any petition or answer
seeking reorganization, readjustment or arrangement of
its business under any law relating to bankruptcy or
insolvency;

(4) the appointment of a receiver for all or substantially
all of the property of the other party;

(5) the making by the other party of any assignment for the
benefit of creditors;

(6) the institution of any proceedings for the liquidation
or winding up of the other party's business or for the
termination of its corporate charter;

(7) the other party undergoes a Change of Control. For
purposes of this Section 6.2(b)(7), "Change of Control"
shall mean a transaction or a series of related
transactions in which (i) one or more related parties
who did not previously own at least a fifty percent
(50%) interest in a party to this Agreement obtain at
least a fifty percent (50%) interest in such party, and,
in the reasonable business judgment of the other party
to this Agreement, such change in ownership will have a
material effect on the other party's business, or (ii) a
party acquires, by merger, acquisition of assets or
otherwise, all or any portion of another legal entity
such that either the assets or market value of such
party after the close of such transaction are greater
than one and one third (1 1/3) of the assets or market
value of such party prior to such transaction.

That will pretty much kill the transfer of the x86 license with Intel. According to the contract, the license does not transfer with a sale, acquisition, merger, or bankruptcy of AMD. It just gets revoked.

So when AMD goes bankrupt that is the end of it. A company like Samsung COULD buy AMD, but they would not be able to produce any x86 CPUs. Intel would terminate the license as per the terms of the contract.

6:58 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

@core2dude

hey got a link for that last post of 65% to 70% inventory???

7:06 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

onlyamd: the information is on AMD's own site:

http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/content_type/DownloadableAssets/Q207Financials.pdf

Inventory of $892m on revenue of $1.378 billion. That's inventory equal to 64% of AMD's quarterly revenue.

7:11 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

AMD is in trouble. Positioning the Pentium E 2140 at $64 is a brilliant tactic by Intel to stop the flood of AMD's cheap dual core CPUs. http://xtreview.com/addcomment-id-2919-view-Pentium-e2140-price-drop.html

8:29 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Scientia from AMDZone said...

It takes a lot of sifting to find good points in these commments; the ratio of insults to good point seems to be about 2:1.

Is it bad that AMD lost $600 Million. Yes, of course it is. So, is this quarter as bad as last quarter? No. There are definite improvements. Volume is up and profit per chip is up. These are both positive changes. The inventory is still higher than I would like it but at least it did drop by 5%.

Frankly, I don't understand the comments about ATI. Every here knows that Intel canceled its orders and that R600 was late. And, R600 on those 80hs transistors draws too much power. I would imagine AMD can sell some of the lower graphic chips but this arrived so late that it couldn't have had much effect on the quarter. There should be more sales in Q3 but AMD is going to need to move this to 65nm to really get it moving. And, if this happens this year that would be good.

Also, for anyone who is counting the days until AMD goes bankrupt you should know that Germany came up with $360 Million in aid for AMD. It'll help a bit. Also, AMD should be pulling tooling out of FAB 30 now. So, this might be $100 or $200 Million in Q3. Things like this keep pushing a potential bankruptcy back further and further.

Q3 will only be a few K10 server chips. K10 server volume should be good in Q4 with a few desktop chips. Real volume of K10 desktop is Q1 08 with mobile in Q2 08. Mobile is interesting because this is the first time that AMD will have a mobile designed cpu and a mobile designed chipset. This is also the first time that Centrino gets a solid competitor. The mobile chipset is a solid payoff from the ATI purchase BTW. Also, in Q1 08 AMD should be fielding the replacement to the current 690G chipset (which is doing fine).

It is looking like AMD will have 2.4Ghz server chips in Q4. This means that K10 should gain a little on Intel even if Intel releases 3.2Ghz chips. It is looking like 2.6Ghz in Q1 08. Of course, Intel may bump quad core up to 3.33Ghz. If Intel does this it would cancel most of AMD's increase. AMD can theoretically get to 2.8Ghz in Q3 but after that we shift to Nehalem and 45nm for AMD.

I suppose the bottom line is that with each quarter AMD does get something a little better. It's difficult at this point to argue that AMD will go bankrupt unless AMD cannot get losses under control by Q1 08, Intel is able to bump the clock above 3.33Ghz (for example, 3.6Ghz in Q2 would make AMD lose ground), or we shift the conversation to Nehalem (which is still mostly an unknown).

9:21 PM, July 20, 2007  
Blogger Ycon said...

AMD just CANT do 45nm. Deal with it.

2:39 AM, July 21, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

Hell AMD can barely manage 65um...

3:52 AM, July 21, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Scientia: First of all, I would sincerely hope that AMD's next 2 quarters are better. The main reason is that the PC industry has yearly cycles, and the 3rd quarter (back to school sales) and 4th quarter (Christmas/holiday sales) are typically pretty strong.
Having said that, while the 2nd quarter is often soft, this year's 2nd quarter was pretty strong as they go. Also, it's not that AMD lost money, everybody was expecting that, it's that they lost even more money than anyone had predicted. Sharikou can trumpet some meaningless shipment number to make things look better, but when you ship more chips in order to lose even more money it's not a winning strategy.
Remember, just 1 year ago AMD's revenue was lower (at only $1.22 billion) but AMD was actually able to make a small profit on the quarter. Ask yourself, would you rather have $1.38 billion in revenue and lose $600 million or only have $1.22 billion in revenue and make $88 million?

So here is AMD's big problem: It is in a price war with Intel, but does not have chips that are designed to be profitable while in a price war. At this point AMD had better sign-off on the high-end for the foreseeable future, it literally cannot make chips that will compete with the higher-end Intels.
However, that does not mean AMD cannot compete, it just has to do it at the mid-range and low end, and offer a better price than Intel is willing to do in order to keep 15-20% of the market.
AMD's downfall right now is that it does not have a chip that can capture this segment of the market and also make AMD a profit. The K10?? The damn thing is 283 square millimeters! Do you have any idea how expensive it is to make that thing, especially considering AMD's more complex SoI process and already existing issues at 65nm?? (And Sharikou & onemoron: having a really complex process is not something to brag about, when Intel can make better chips using a simpler, cheaper, and more reliable process it's Intel with the advantage).
So, the K10 might be a profitable chip if the price was about $1200, but at an introductory price under $400.... forget about it. Now I know AMD intends to have faster parts at some point, but remember, the cost to make a slow K10 is identical to the cost to make a fast K10, and even using AMD's optimistic roadmap it will be a while before the fast K10's show up.

The other way that AMD is in trouble is this: While the K10 ramp is going on, that capacity is not available to make cheaper 65nm K8 parts that might be sold very cheap to (possibly) make a profit. After the price cuts AMD inflicted on itself in a (panicked) response to Intel, AMD is losing money on every high-end K8 chip it sells (meaning your 2.6Ghz+ chips that are still made on the 90nm process). AMD might be able to make money if it could make the K8's on the 65nm process, and also ramp up the process so it can actually make the high-end chips (even a 3.2Ghz power-hog 6200+ would help if it was priced at $175).
So what's the problem? Well, the capacity is being eaten by K10's that are going to take up massive wafer real estate!

So AMD finds itself in a pickle, it needs to be able to make lower-cost chips that can compete in the low to mid-range on price.... but at the same time its fab capacity is being taken over by a very high-priced K10 that is not going to yield any major performance crowns within the next 6 months (if ever).

That is why AMD is in trouble, and nobody seems to want to talk about it.

8:25 AM, July 21, 2007  
Blogger oneexpert said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

10:33 AM, July 21, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Oneexpert: As usual you are a drooling retard.
Intel's revenues did not drop at all, they were up over last year, and their profit went up 44% (AMD doesn't make a profit so it's hard to compare the two).

Since you like to lie about what Intel executives say, how about we make up some stuff about Hector & crew (except this is actually true):
Hector Ruiz said: "I got $16 million last year for driving this company into the ground, I've got a nice gold parachute and I'm set for life! Suckas!"

Randy Allen said: "Yeah, it was great, those morons ate it up when I said K10 was 7000% faster than anything Intel will make in the next 10 years. Oh, you mean we actually have to make it? That's just a detail, I have another slide show to put on! I think this time I'll say K10 is 25000% percent faster, this is easy!"

SoI process!!! Who the fuck cares? You AMD types scream that it does not matter that Intel is at 45nm first, but then you bitch and moan about SoI? Try checking on the rumors that even AMD is finally abandoning SoI for its 32nm generation (it apparently will never have a 45 nm generation, and 32 may no happen if the financials don't recover).

Oh and oneretard, you insulted AMD in that useless diatribe of your when you dissed strained silicon... that's an AMD trick that Intel never had to bother to do! Hey Sharikou, oneexpert is insulting AMD again, he's a traitor to your cause, kill him!!

11:17 AM, July 21, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

It's quite humorous when oneexpert says that 'AMD is killing Intel' because Intel only has an 18% profit margain during a price war! What's AMD's profit margain? Non existent. AMD has bled in excess of $1.7bn cash in the last three quarters.

6:22 PM, July 21, 2007  
Blogger NT78stonewobble said...

"Can intel be saved????"

Stupid

"Does anybody want to save intel????"

Stupid

"Intel spent trillions of advertising dollars this last Q2 trying to convince the world that there antique glued up pentium 3s were state of the art value cpus. intels efforts failed, they were beat out by AMD."

Yet the core2 are the best performing chips a.t.m. thus your comment is stupid.

"P.Otellini,Demand for desktop processors was higher than in past years, although INTELS REVENUE DROPPED due to a lower average selling price of its products."

Yet they are still making money compaired to AMD. Your comment is stupid.

"Otellini said that intel had lost the american market."

Stupid

"Otellini said that AMD is killing intel profitability."

Stupid since compaired to intel AMD doesn't have any profitability...

"Intel was counting on 30% to 40% profit per chip and cant manage on 18%."

Amd has no profit thus your comment is stupid

"INTELS bottom line benefited from a workforce decimation to produce any profit at all.(fired 10,500)"

Who cares? Intel's bottom line is in the black. AMD's in the RED thus your comment is stupid.

"Intel produced less product in Q2 than they had in Q1."

Stupid

"AMD produced a lot more product in Q2 than in Q1."

And lost even more or what? Stupid

"AMD is expanding while intel is shrinking."

Stupid

"IBMs SOI process is the only process to produce production cpus with speeds of 4.7ghz."

Sounds like AMD is going the prescott route... Stupid

"AMD uses IBMs SOI process.
Strained silicon is as antique as c2ds design and unfortunately for intel the world knows it."

Stupid

"I dont think even intel has enough money to buy there way out of the mess they are in."

Intel has money, AMD have to loan em... Stupid comment by you...

"Intel does not have a single cheap energy saving cpu and platform in there line up."

Stupid

"AMD has beat intel on the home field and the rest of the world will soon follow and they did it for 600mill."

Stupid

"AMD is killing intels bottom line and intel has no way to stop it.
Reworked pentium 3s are not the computing future."

Even more stupid

"AMDs brisbane and barcelona are light years ahead of intel."

Brisbane ain't and barcelona ain't out yet. Stupid comment.

"Customers run software not benchmarks,"

Yet you claim barcelona is lightyears ahead based on benchmarks? Contradicting stupidity...

"they need low cost, good performance, power saving, cpus and platforms"

I'll get a nice core 2 thank you very much...

" like the stuff built by AMD."

Not a.t.m. stupid ...

"High performance gives bragging rights but there are alot more energy saving chey aveos sold than corvettes."

Well I like the best performance in the games I play. For energy conserving try turning your computer off when not in use...

"Intel cant give away core 2 duo, nobody wants it or needs it or believes in it."

I want it. So youre wrong or stupid.

"Intels quad is just two glued together core 2 duos, twice the power sucking trouble."

Well If I need a quadcore I'll take a quadcore not a non existant AMD product... Stupid...

"Next the only core 2 duo signs you see will be at antique stores where they belong."

Stupid

"BUY AMD...low cost, energy saving, cpus and platforms."

Stupid...

Buy AMD if you're on a budget og need extremely low energy usage. If you want performance and can afford a few extra pennies on the power bills use Intel...

9:20 AM, July 22, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

OK AMD fanboys, you want to talk marketshare, let's talk marketshare.

Some preliminary numbers are in right here. If you think digitimes is an Intel pumper site, AMDzone linked to the same story right here and calling AMDzone Intel pumpers is stupid even for only_amd and oneretard.

So kids, here's the bottom line: After the 'flood' of products, hype, fire-sale price cuts, panicked cuts days before Intel was going to cut prices, and dumping $30 million in inventory AMD gained: 0.5% marketshare.

Hold on Sharikou & onedefective, I didn't say 5% I said 0.5% or one-half of one percent or 5 one-thousandths of the market share, 0.005. Now that I've said the same number in several different ways that any 3rd grader should know how to interpret, I'm sure you'll flat-out lie about it.

So, what did 0.5% of marketshare cost AMD to get? Oh, about $600 million dollars..... I don't call that a very good bargain. Intel's market share in Q1 was 80.8% and the estimate is it is 80.5% now. AMD is not taking up all the rest, rather it is now sitting at 11.4% marketshare.... still nowhere near where it was in 2006.

Hey Sharikou, I thought you said that by now AMD was supposed to have 60% marketshare and that Intel would be almost BK.... so what is up with 11.4%? Oh wait, you just make complete BS statements with no factual basis and then claim to be correct when your own predictions turn out to be completely and utterly wrong. Have you considered working for the CIA looking for weapons of mass destruction? Or a few years ago did you work for the Iraqi information ministry saying how great Saddam was when the US tanks were rolling in Baghdad?

I'll let the article speak for itself:
"The main cause of the market-share reversal of fortune was a decline in Intel's processor average selling prices (ASPs)," said Matthew Wilkins, principal analyst for compute platforms research at iSuppli. "This caused Intel's revenue share to decline – although its processor unit shipments were up sequentially. However, with only a 1% swing in market share between the two companies in the first quarter, the second quarter essentially maintained the status quo of the first quarter, with no significant trade in market-share position between the two main processor suppliers to the PC and server segments."

So AMD: Good job, you managed to not actually lose marketshare (although you should note that Intel did actually increase chip sales, it was just that the market itself grew). At 0.5% per $600 million in losses, it should only take $3Billion in losses to get to 16.4%.... right back where you were in 2006! Good luck with that!

3:29 PM, July 22, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Oh wait... I must have done some Sharikou math there for a second I apologize.

In my previous post when I said it would cost AMD $3 Billion in losses to get to 16.4% market share, I didn't correctly multiply the numbers... It's pretty obvious, 5% is 10 times of 0.5% so 10 times of the $600 million loss is of course: $6 Billion in losses to recover the 2006 marketshare.

Now realistically, AMD could come out with a high-performance CPU and also GPUs that it could sell in large quantities at high prices and gain back marketshare in a way that would actually generate profit.... Oh wait, I'm sorry, I said 'realistically' and they don't have anything that will be worthy of a higher price coming anytime soon! :p

3:47 PM, July 22, 2007  
Blogger JoJo said...

Here's what I truly don't understand good doctor of bullshit, why are you so damn eager to see Intel go BK? (to everyone else I know this is 100% impossible at this time cause Intel is trouncing AMD and has future trouncing plans in place). If Intel goes BK, AMD processor prices will skyrocket. There will be little need to compete technologically (because of the lack of a competitor) so we'll all be dead before the world sees a 4Ghz processor or an octo-core. It will most likely do irreversible damage to the PC market as a whole, and in 10 years, we'll all be using fucking macs. WTF ARE YOU THINKING JACKASS? I don't believe that you believe the things that you post. You simply MUST know that your at least full of shit to a degree. This is a fanboy blog, but I don't mean just an AMD fanboy blog. The only people who can compare to what a fucking moron you are (if you are really serious about all this), are the Intel fanboys saying AMD is going BK and it's good and blah blah blah. I'm pretty sure you just started a typical AMD fanboy-esque blog and, seeing the reactions that any positive AMD news got out of Intel fanboys, you decided to post more and more AMD supporting news. Well, if I've figured out your secret, and there is some sort of prize, email me at disturbedjasonx@gmail.com. I am fairly confident there is some sort of contest or conspiracy or cult or substance abuse going on. If it is substance abuse, I suggest DXM. It's available cheaply in Robotussin Cough Gel Caps. Take 20 and you'll be on a trip, 40 if you wanna see some shit. I'd love to see what you have to say about AMD after doing that shit. (Actually I don't expect it to be that much different) Seriously though, I really am looking for an answer to my earlier question though. Why do you strive for a PC consumers Dooms Day? I don't mean it rhetorically, really, I want to know you're reasons.

9:44 PM, July 22, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Look at this long list of Core 2 Duo awards:
http://www.intel.com/pressroom/kits/core2duo/awards.htm?iid=homepage+news_core_award

Clearly, all these sites must be paid Intel pumpers!!

10:10 PM, July 22, 2007  
Blogger JoJo said...

Yeah, you laugh, but don't think Intel nor AMD are above buying awards.

10:45 PM, July 22, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Here is an interesting VMware performance PDF from Dell:

http://www.dell.com/downloads/global/solutions/poweredge_vmmark_final.pdf

We can see the benefits of quad core clearly here. The dual Clovertown systems beats a quad Tulsa setup and comes very close to the performance of the quad Opteron setup. This is in spite of the fact that the 4P machines had 64GB of ram vs. only 48GB on the Clovertown system.

If you look at the cost of the CPUs alone for those machines:

4x Opteron 8220SE = $6056
4x Xeon 7410M = $7920
2x Xeon X5355 $2344

(All CPUs Dell used in the test are one speed-grade lower than the fastest CPU)

Clearly, the 2P Quad core systems offers almost all of the performance of a 4P system at a much lower price now. It won't be until Barcelona and Tigerton are out that this will be changed.

12:38 AM, July 23, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

AMD 6400+ coming. Another 90nm CPU with high TDP. No thanks.

2:48 AM, July 23, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Hey Giant, good catch on the 6400+ rumors. I guess AMD took my advice on putting out a stop-gap 3.2Ghz CPU. OK, I know it wasn't really me, but it's nice to predict something right... Sharikou.

Anyway here's a quote from the digitimes article:

In testing, performance of the 6400+ is 10-15% below the E6850, and the CPU has limited overclock capability, said the sources, who also pointed out that the price gap compared to the E6850 is not huge.

I would love to see how much power this monster will suck down. I don't know what will be more funny... how inefficient this chip is, or how much oneexpert will scream about how AMD's are so much more efficient........ lunatics.

6:48 AM, July 23, 2007  
Blogger Rodney said...

That's quite a story, Enrique. I like stories. I like stories about pinatas. In fact, I like everything you have to say.

8:25 AM, July 23, 2007  
Blogger JoJo said...

Speaking of which is anyone excited for the PC port of Viva Pinata?
That game looks like it's gonna be sweet. I played it at a friends house on Xbox and it was awesome. My favorite are the fox pinata, but they are always eating my rabbit pinata. :'-(

1:52 PM, July 23, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

Just a good article to read. Nothing to rave about just good info.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/cmp/20070723/
tc_cmp/201200377;
_ylt=AlSgkGHSQIn6nBr2K7BZt6EE1vAI

5:38 PM, July 23, 2007  
Blogger Kevin said...

http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=21353453

"Also, I found something interesting in one of the other AMD datasheets I was looking at. Ever wonder why AMD's Brisbane chips do so much better in idle power dissipation tests done by reviews...? It's because they enabled a new mobile sleep state on it.

http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/content_type/white_papers_and_tech_docs/32559.pdf

Check out Table 64 on page 278. Previously, desktop chips supported no better than C1 Halt state. Starting with G-step (Brisbane), they now support C3.

Interesting that AMD has needed to start enabling mobile sleep states on their desktop parts. Intel's mobile parts support all the way down to C4E, while their desktop parts only support C1E. C4E flushes the cache and goes to a lower voltage than regular C4. C1E is also lower voltage than regular C1. Note that Brisbane also supports C1E and can hit lower idle power in that state. AMD doesn't state the voltage of that state, so I didn't bother listing it in the above tables. At any rate, their C1 is still at 1.1V, which is nice, because it lines up with current 90nm parts.

Anyway, I thought people would find this interesting."

6:51 PM, July 23, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

Looks like AMD is having massive problems with leakage moving to 65um...

http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards/read_msg.asp?message_id=21353453


So not only is AMD "cheating" by putting the processor to sleep when idle, they are also having issues with the 65um ramp...

DOH!

1:21 PM, July 24, 2007  
Blogger core2dude said...


So not only is AMD "cheating" by putting the processor to sleep when idle, they are also having issues with the 65um ramp...

How exactly is that cheating? I think that the only reason Intel is not doing it is because then the desktop CPUs will become strong competitors for SFF HTPC solutions--a market currently dominated by much more expensive mobile processors.

If fact, if Intel read these tricks, I would expect them to enable these sleep states on the server front, but not do anything about the desktop front.

2:31 PM, July 24, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Yeah evil_merlin... as much as I am not enamored with the 'new' AMD I will give them credit on the sleep-state front, it's a smart idea to put the CPU into a sleep state even on a desktop when it is not actually in use. Now the AMD power usage when actually doing work is a whole different mess.

Oh and oneexpert, just remember... Intel already can do even better sleep states in its laptop chips, and since the Core architecture is unified from laptop all the way to server, there is no reason Intel could not easily put these features into newer chips without too much trouble.

I partially agree with core2_dude, there could be some market-segmentation reasons for regular dual-core desktop CPUs vs. mobile CPUs. However, I think one area Intel might add the sleep states is in quad-core CPUs (like the coming Yorkfields). The reason is, these are already high-end chips so no stepping on toes in market share, and also the power savings would be the greatest with the most cores.

2:48 PM, July 24, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Oh dear, the one place that AMD still had leadership (MP servers) will be gone. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/07/24/intel_tigerton_photonics/

Tigerton to tear Barcelona to pieces. 32P, that's 128 Tigerton cores. Barcelona maxes out at 8P, or 32 cores. AMD will be less than 20% of Intel's server performance.

The only reason AMD had any leadership at all left in MP servers was because they were competing against Tulsa, a netburst CPU.

AMD BK Q2'08.

5:05 PM, July 24, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Sharikou is a fool. He claims that Intel is losing profit by lowering prices on the quad cores, this is simply untrue. As SPARKS on Roborat's blog pointed out, people are buying these quads in record numbers.

http://www.dailytech.com/Intel+Price+Cuts+Now+You+See+it+Now+You+Dont/article8137.htm

One major U.S. vendor, who spoke on terms of anonymity, claims his company sold no less than "five figures" worth of units since the 21st.

Yes, just one retailer sold well over 10,000 units in 24 -> 48 hours. Intel might have made more profit per unit when the quad was $530, but at $266 they are selling many, many more units and are as such taking market from AMD and making extra profit at the same time. There is no such demand for AMD CPUs.

Remember: The 4x4 killer; just $266.

AMD BK Q2'08.

6:26 PM, July 24, 2007  
Blogger pointer said...

Kevin said...

Intel's mobile parts support all the way down to C4E, while their desktop parts only support C1E


not exactly, the Intel Conroe actually support up to C2E. you can enable this through the BIOS option and observe it through the perfmon.

8:48 PM, July 24, 2007  
Blogger leguas666 said...

Lots of intel pumper-CON on this board.

9:19 PM, July 24, 2007  
Blogger oneexpert said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

12:17 AM, July 25, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Lots of AMD paid pumpers on this board.

12:41 AM, July 25, 2007  
Blogger oneexpert said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

8:01 AM, July 25, 2007  
Blogger oneexpert said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

10:57 AM, July 25, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

oneexpert... why did you delete your earlier comment? I mean, it was just as stupid as your newest comment, so I don't see what the big deal is.
Oh yeah, one Intel executive cashing in a few shares while his company is raking in over a Billion dollars per quarter in profit is the biggest conspiracy of all time.... give me a break.
If you want blatant dishonesty... just read any of oneexpert's posts.

10:59 AM, July 25, 2007  
Blogger yomamafor2 said...

oneexpert
BUY energy saving cpus and platforms from AMD.. a growth company.

Henri? Is that you?

12:08 PM, July 25, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

oneexpert is the village moron.

You get used to ignoring him after a while.

Can oneexpert kindly explain why Intel's top of the line chip uses less power than AMD's top of the line chip?


I think that maybe Sharikou has some help when strangling himself... oneexpert is there reading his moronic posts as he enters them. What a stroke fest between the two...

2:09 PM, July 25, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Hey Sharikou & onedroolingmoron: If Intel is so terrible, then obviously a company that only sells Intel CPUs in its systems must be having a terrible time right? I mean, if AMD is dominating so much, a company that doesn't sell AMD chips must be about to go out of business... you know, a company like Apple.

Apple generates $818 million in quarterly profits. During that one quarter Apple sold 1.764 million Macs (and when you consider the Mac Pro towers each use 2 Intel chips, that's twice the chips for that part of the high-end spectrum).
What's even more funny is that Apple by itself probably sold more dual-socket Intel systems than all those vendors of the PoS '4x4' debacle put together!

Now, since I'm not a fanboy it's obvious that Apple has had success in other products like the iPod and (just a little bit) of the iPhone, but Mac sales are very strong and despite a bunch of fear at first, everyone in the Mac world is very happy using Intel CPUs instead of those heaters IBM was dumping on Apple.

4:11 PM, July 25, 2007  
Blogger oneexpert said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

4:38 PM, July 25, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

Hey wouldn't you like to be a pumper too..Rhymes with (Dr Pepper) you know the song...

5:29 PM, July 25, 2007  
Blogger lex said...

Patty and those other executives must be be laughing all the way to the bank.

Why aren't AMD executives exercising their options? Because they are all underwater and worthless. Your stock don't do well when you lose 500millin plus a quarter, your products suck, your technology is behind and your next generation product is late and slow..

Did you read about AMD debt getting downgraded soon.

BK soon I say

6:43 PM, July 25, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

oneexpert
"BUY energy saving cpus and platforms from AMD.. a growth company."

Anyone wants to guess the TDP of 6400+?

12:23 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger NT78stonewobble said...

Well on this day where I'm not hallucinating things and denying simple facts... Unlike some people here.

I do hope that neither Intel nor AMD bankrupts and that they will be able to push eachother aggressively for a long time.

Pushing performance up and prices down.

Hopefully most normal people can agree on this.

1:38 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

Seems like our "friend" (and I'm sure we are the only ones that he has) oneexpert seems to forget that Intel has a whole line of low power consumption processors out there.

I guess the world is luck that Intel makes 85% of all the laptop CPU's out there as AMD's are typically using 2x the power and don't have a low power consumption, let alone a very low power consumption CPU line for laptops.

the best thing is, if you want your AMD desktop system to save power, you can't use an AMD video card in it...

7:21 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger core2dude said...

Today AMD demonstrated 3.0GHz Barcelona. Now that is a news worth reporting on a technology blog.

Pretty impressive. However, the chip was a Pehnom, not an Opteron. Would be interesting to know the TDP of that chip.

9:29 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger oneexpert said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

10:05 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

They showed a single Phenom at 3Ghz. They didn't state if it was dual core quad core.

It's easy enough to cherry pick a few of the best CPUs. The question is, can AMD deliver them in quantity?

10:43 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

AMD shows off 3.0Ghz Barcelona

With three GPUs

AMD shows a 3Ghz Phenom running the new 'Tri-Fire multi-GPU' setup.

Responses accepted!!! No cursing!!!

11:06 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

OK, one_amd here's my response: Where and when will it actually be physically possible to buy one? Not to mention the fact that they had a controlled display, if AMD was so confident they'd also have sample systems out to all the review sites with full benchmarks already. Don't try to blow crap at me about how that would either 'tip off' Intel or would somehow hurt existing Athlon sales... we're about 6 months past that point right now and you know it.
Oh and oneexpert, before you claim that this system uses 0 energy and will somehow save all the whales or something idiotic.... I haven never seen that many case fans in my entire life on a single system! Even if this thing is actually a quad core at 3Ghz, it's power usage must be enormous.

11:23 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger rathor said...

Ho ho ho intelers... 3 Ghz Phenom, 3 x 2900 XT gcards on the same mobo. Intel in trully fucked and blown away in pieces... Intel, Intel fanbois, anything ? Yes, yes, I know... it's hard to accept, but AMD time has come. And well, yes, Intel fanbois, you can flame, frag, etc. It doesn't matter anymore.

11:26 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

@ chuckula

Sgt Schultz

I know nothing...nothing

11:33 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

Lil note;

Motherboard makers doubt performance claims of upcoming Intel IGP drivers

mmmmmmmmm

11:41 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger core2dude said...


It's easy enough to cherry pick a few of the best CPUs. The question is, can AMD deliver them in quantity?

Cherry-picked or not. It shows that there are no fundamental speed paths in Barcelona that will prevent it from hitting 3 GHz. Improving yields is a process issue.

The 2.GHz launch was making me wonder if there were fundamental speed-path issues in the new core.

11:44 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

With three 2900's in that thing, one could power a whole city.

So much for oneexperts power saving claims.

Never the less I won't be holding my breath for the release of Phenom which isn't due till Q2 2008.

11:47 AM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

It was a QUAD CORE...Not good news for Intelers...

In fact, the company also demonstrated a quad-core Phenom running at 3GHz with an ATI Tri-Fire multi-GPU configuration and the RD790 enthusiast chipset. Rick Bergman, now the general manager of the Consumer Electronics and Graphics Product Group (GPG) divisions (after Dave Orton's resignation), said that all these products and components being demonstrated will be available for delivery this year, and encouraged those in attendance to note that there were no special cooling tricks being used to manipulate the machine.

2:53 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

Ho ho ho intelers... 3 Ghz Phenom, 3 x 2900 XT gcards on the same mobo

Want to bet that 2x 8800GTX beats the setup hands-down in GPU limited scenarios? Anyone wants to compare power usage of such systems?

Also a whole new 65nm flagship GPU will be out from NVidia in Q4. Remember, current G80 is at 90nm vs R600 80nm and uses less power and has considerably better performance. Just imagine what will happen with going to 65nm.


"Cherry-picked or not. It shows that there are no fundamental speed paths in Barcelona that will prevent it from hitting 3 GHz"

There are quadcore Core2's you can run at 3.7GHz on air too, what does that mean?

3:28 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

In fact, the company also demonstrated a quad-core Phenom running at 3GHz

How is this bad news for me? I want AMD to not suck goat-balls and actually get off its ass and produce a better chip... that way Intel will actually release Penryn sooner rather than later... don't get me wrong, even if Phenom runs at 3Ghz it will be a power hog, but if it scares Intel enough to release Penryn early I'm all for it.

You often here the 'competition is good' slogan thrown around to justify buying an inferior AMD product... what those idiots forgot is that competition has to involve a product that is conceivably worth buying. I want AMD to do the actual 'competing' part which they seem to have given up on in 2006.

4:00 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

Did you guys see the photo of that system?

The ENTIRE CASE SIDE is made out of fans.

Holy Crap! You're talking about having to remove over 1000 watts of heat from the case.

The thing is a friggin blow dryer.

BTW, AMD didn't demostrate the actual system, they sent screen shots to the news sites.

4:59 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

Can't people read or what! Its a gaming system!

In fact, the company also demonstrated a quad-core Phenom running at 3GHz with an ATI Tri-Fire multi-GPU configuration and the RD790 enthusiast chipset. Rick Bergman, now the general manager of the Consumer Electronics and Graphics Product Group (GPG) divisions (after Dave Orton's resignation), said that all these products and components being demonstrated will be available for delivery this year, and encouraged those in attendance to note that there were no special cooling tricks being used to manipulate the machine.

5:17 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

No special cooling tricks? You mean the Great Wall of Fans on that case is not 'special'?
That's like me dipping the CPU in a vat of liquid nitrogen, bragging that I dipped the CPU in a vat of liquid nitrogen, and then because I admitted I actually dipped the CPU in a vat of liquid nitrogen coming out and saying no 'tricks' were used!

5:21 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

Latest road map but i guess these will be hot too for the same excuse.
http://images.dailytech.com/nimage
/5488_large_performanceplatforms.jpg


First 2.0 MHz wasn't fast enough, after 3.0 MHz was demonstrated today as a gaming system fault had to be as to hot a setup. WoW all those fans! Not a typical case or system build either. Just simply a demonstration!

5:39 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

What did the guy in Taiwan use for his Intel demo to try & get to 5.0MHz???

Can we say LIQUID NITROGEN boys & girls!!!!

5:42 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Thank you for showing that I am right only_amd:
I never said that dipping a CPU in liquid nitrogen is 'normal' I was making a point by example!
When the guys in Taiwan overclocked an Intel CPU to 5Ghz did any of them (or anyone else) say: "Oh yeah, this is a perfectly normal desktop that everybody runs!" Of course not you idiot, they did it to attract attention. Intel only advertises CPUs at up to 3Ghz right now because that is how fast they run without 'special tricks' (actually they usually run faster as the huge number of overclockers show, but for economic reasons Intel only bins parts up to 3Ghz since AMD can't even beat the lower binned parts right now).

Now, take this AMD system with the massive cooling and 3 freakin' video cards... AMD is calling a wall of fans 'normal' and everyone is supposed to think that this is what to expect for a desktop.... I don't think so.

Before you say: "Oh this is a high-end desktop!" I sure as hell don't need a wall of fans to cool a QX6850, and another point: I can actually buy a QX6850 right now if I really want to... good luck doing that with a 3Ghz Phenom this year.

5:54 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

@chuckla

Only a demo! Get it!!!!

6:04 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

Good news for intel pumpers...


Brussels charges Intel with market abuse. t has also faced accusations that it paid retailers not to stock computers using AMD chips and engaged in "predatory pricing" tactics.

Intel could face fines worth up to 10 per cent of its annual global revenues. The company, under chief executive Paul Otellini, reported sales of $35.4bn in 2006, which would equate to a possible fine of more than $3.5bn.

6:35 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

And yet the announcement of these charges does absolutly nothing to Intel's stock price.

Can you say "irrelevent"?

Or how about "innocent until proven guilty", which still applies, even is socialist Europe.

6:41 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

Read again! It says charged...Must have some good info to bring charges.

6:43 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

Brussels, S.Korea, Japan, US, EU all bringing charges against intel or most already filed.

Where oh where is our profits going? To the lawyers dummies not to stockholders!!!

6:47 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger core2dude said...


There are quadcore Core2's you can run at 3.7GHz on air too, what does that mean?

Actually, almost any of the recent Core 2's will clock to 3.7GHz on hot air. That is not the point of my post. I do not necessarily see 3 GHz Phenom as end of Intel, but rather an indication that AMD may not go BK by Q2 '08. As they will be able to price these 3GHz parts at around $300.

6:50 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Chuckula said...

Go on living in your fantasy-world only_amd where you can just pretend big bad Intel will just disappear when the nice men from the government come to enforce the bribes AMD payed them.

Watch out though, because those same government people can come after you, in fact here's an actual link: Right here looks like AMD could be in trouble too.... when you ask the big bad government to take out your competition instead of actually trying to make a good product, you better watch your back because you could be next.

6:54 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

Okay, now Only AMD is the runner up behind onemoron for stupidity.

1. I did say "charged" I'm sure the financial markets also read "charged". Do you know what "charged" means?

2. Brussels is the EU, they are not separate entities.

3. Intel has not been found guilty of anything in all the cases you site.

6:55 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

Woops forgot one.

4. Please tell me about when the US has ever brought charges against Intel.

Moron #2 award has been given to only amd.

Keep posting this ignorant babble, and you could pass pass up onemoron for the top spot.

7:00 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Evil_Merlin said...

AMD... when you can't make it in the real world, per the typical US whine, you sue.

AMD, not only are they producing a sub-performing CPU, they are pussies that can't compete because they:

1.) Cant make enough product
2.) Can't make a product that can compete with Intel's best
3.) Can't create a diverse enough product lineup.


Ever notice the AMD fanbois move the goal posts every time they are on the losing side of an argument?

7:01 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Wow! 3Ghz Quad core and 3 GPUs! Too bad Intel has had 3Ghz quad cores out for months. 3 GPUs? Who cares. Nvidia had Quad SLI out last year. Dual 8800 Ultra SLI will beat out Tri 2900 Crossfire anyway.

7:32 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger tech4life said...

Giant said
Dual 8800 Ultra SLI will beat out Tri 2900 Crossfire anyway.


Oh really?

8:41 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Bubba said...

Hahahaha!

"two ASUS Radeon HD 2900 XTs running in a CrossFire config, paired up with an Intel QX6700 which was overclocked to 5029MHz "

1. Don't quote the Inq, it makes you look bad.

2. 3DMark isn't a game, and is AMD friendly.

3. He said Qaud SLI, the article talks about SLI.

8:50 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Quad SLI was simply a point I was making; using more than two GPUs is nothing new. Nvidia's highest performing platform would use two 8800 Ultra GPUs.

Yes, really. 3Dmark isn't what I'd call "AMD friendly", but it is not an accurate representation of what people do with high end video cards.

I don't know about you tech4life, but I own an 8800 GTS card. It cost me ~$400 at the start of the year. When I spend that sort of cash on a high end video card I'm going to use it to play games; not run 3Dmark over and over! I'm going to run games with the best visual experience possible. All the visual settings at full, and Anti-Aliasing/Anisotropic filtering as high as I can set them while maintaining a stable frame rate.

You see review sites like Tweaktown.com compare the 2900 XT and the 8800 Ultra. But their reviews are flawed, they're running all these tests, and there's only a tiny section with 3 or 4 benchmarks run with AA/AF enabled. Who would buy buy a high end video card and not use AA/AF?

So yes, it's easy to see that an 8800 Ultra SLI setup would be faster than three 2900 XTs in Crossfire in real world usage scenarios.

10:23 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

10:27 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

giant
"Yes, really. 3Dmark isn't what I'd call "AMD friendly""

Actually in 3dmark 2006 2900XT at default is faster than 8800GTX. We all know how the situation is with real world games.

If some people say that C2D was optimized for SpecInt then perhaps R600 was built for 2dmark ...

10:27 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

Sorry, that was obviously supposed to be 3dmark

10:28 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...


Actually in 3dmark 2006 2900XT at default is faster than 8800GTX. We all know how the situation is with real world games.


That's true. You'll also find the 2900 XT keeps up with the GTX fine when AA/AF are off in games.

But as I said earlier, who runs games on high end video cards without AA/AF? The difference in graphics quality AA/AF makes in games is massive.

10:31 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger lex said...

Yo "Ph"ony "D"umb AMD fanbois..

Don't cumm all over yourself with the power point foils from Dirk or the chargers from EU..

Look at all the EU noise made with Apple and Microsoft. Last I checked Apple and Microsoft are running stronger then ever. EU, Japs, and others all hate successful American companies profiting in their home country. They would do anything to bring them down.

Look at AMD.. billion and half losses, no 65nm quadcore yet.. Oh I guess there is a screen shot of a CPU running 3 GHZ.. but where are the benchmarks? Where are the products... were is AMD going to get the money to compete..

Oh yes by suing others.. what a company...

You guys like Hector he who can't do it alone but crys, whines and has to cheat to catch up. You guys must root for Landis and hard workers like Cristian Moreni too.

10:45 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger lex said...

The "Ph"ony "D"octorate has been pretty quiet. You'd think with all these news items on AMD he'd be ejaculating all over the place.

Maybe mamma got him locked in the basement this past week for being a bad boy

10:46 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger AndyW35 said...

The impressive thing about the Phenom at 3GHz was how small the heatsink was. You can say it had lots of fans but you can have a millin fans if you do not have enough surface area on the heatsink and it will do you no good as you will still be saturated.

3GHz fits in well with a 2.6GHz release, then again I do not think 2.6GHz is going to be enough for a 3.33GHz Penryn, but it will be fairly close.

Good to see AMD perhaps being in the position to make the price war continue.

10:59 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

giant
"You'll also find the 2900 XT keeps up with the GTX fine when AA/AF are off in games."

No it does not. It is barely better than GTS without AA, With AA it is slower than that. There is maybe 1-2 games where R600 is as fast as GTX.


andyw35
"You can say it had lots of fans but you can have a millin fans if you do not have enough surface area on the heatsink and it will do you no good as you will still be saturated."

With massive airflow you don't need lots of surface area.


"3GHz fits in well with a 2.6GHz release"

Are you suggesting that AMD has 3GHz desktop quads availiable this year and reaches 2.6GHZ with 120W quadcore Opterons Q2 next year? Why can't it get 3GHz quadcore opterons sooner?


"Good to see AMD perhaps being in the position to make the price war continue."

AMD has pretty much nothing that could improve its position in Q3. Though it did have massive pricedrops on desktop CPUs earlier this month and I expect it to have a big impact on their profitability.

11:16 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

Did anyone notice that that 3GHz 3-way CF setup used 1200W PSU?

11:31 PM, July 26, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...


No it does not. It is barely better than GTS without AA, With AA it is slower than that. There is maybe 1-2 games where R600 is as fast as GTX.


Your right. Without AA the 2900 XT can barely keep up with the 8800 GTS 640MB. With AA the 2900 XT is fragged by the 8800 GTS 320MB.

1:27 AM, July 27, 2007  
Blogger Giant said...

Confirmed: AMD stuck at 2ghz.

They can only have a handfull of chips that can run at 3ghz:

http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2160&Itemid=34

AMD is finished.

1:37 AM, July 27, 2007  
Blogger tech4life said...

Bubba said

Hahahaha!

"two ASUS Radeon HD 2900 XTs running in a CrossFire config, paired up with an Intel QX6700 which was overclocked to 5029MHz "

1. Don't quote the Inq, it makes you look bad.

2. 3DMark isn't a game, and is AMD friendly.

3. He said Qaud SLI, the article talks about SLI.


You're a funny guy (or just not too bright).

1. You say not to quote the Inq and then you quote the Inq yourself

2. So R600 was optimized for 3dMark? Like Core 2 is optimized for benchmarks?

3. He actually said "dual" SLI not Quad. What would be the point of saying 4 will beat 3? Duh.

5:44 AM, July 27, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

Even AMD quoted INQ on one of its slides :)


"2. So R600 was optimized for 3dMark? Like Core 2 is optimized for benchmarks?"

What I said is that some* speculate that it might be optimized for benchmarks. Though as it also works really well on real-world applications so those people are wrong. R600 on the other hand shows considerably better results in 3dmark when put against similar performace G80 GPU whereas it lags behind in games.

*) abinstein and sharikou. IIRC scientia said something once also but I'm not sure.

6:38 AM, July 27, 2007  
Blogger Only AMD said...

SWEET!!!

6:54 AM, July 27, 2007  
Blogger AndyW35 said...

Ho Ho said

"With massive airflow you don't need lots of surface area."

Actually you still do, otherwise you get saturation and then it does not matter how much air you are blowing over it. Air flow is not as efficient at cooling as conductivity.

Also, the main airflow here is still the standard fan on the heatsink, and it does not look that mighty, all the case fans are mainly for the air being dumped by the graphics cards.

Or are you saying all big air overclockers do not need to bother with Tuniq Towers etc and just need to stick to case fans ? ;)

7:01 AM, July 27, 2007  
Blogger Ho Ho said...

I'm just saying that regular household fan lowered the temperature of my old Prescott by over 10C when I placed it besides my opened PC. I used regular inbox cooler.

8:33 AM, July 27, 2007  

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