Thursday, June 01, 2006

Turion 64 X2 notebooks in stock at HP.com

The world's only dual core 64 bit technology, the Turion 64 X2, is available in the form of HP DV2000z and Compaq V3000Z. I wonder why there are people buying 32 bit notebooks today.

Intel's Mooly Eden said two 32 bit cores were better than one 64 bit core. How about two 32 bit core against two 64 bit cores?

BTW: look at this wall socket PC that can even run off power over ethernet.

31 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

K8L, Turions whatever...
I only hope that X2 4000+ is going to cost 150$ soon! AMD - it's time to lower the prices!

1:57 PM, June 01, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I wonder why there are people buying 32 bit notebooks today

because there is no useable 64 bit operating system for mobile computers around!?

2:29 PM, June 01, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

um are there ANY 64 bits apps for the common consumer? NO (well outside of a select few with the help of some amd marketing money) vista is 32 and 64 bits. consumers don't really need what is offered by 64 bit software for a while like probably for another year. yes vista will be out within a year (i hope) but will offer next to nothing over 32 bit OS's. don't forget anything mobile from intel (well pentium-m based/derivatives) have amd beat in 32 bit stuff and battery consumption. and well the last time i checked, 32 bit was still king in everything but mid to high servers and high end workstations.

2:31 PM, June 01, 2006  
Blogger Sharikou, Ph. D said...

are there ANY 64 bits apps for the common consumer?

32 bit has the shelf life of a banana. Vista will be out in just a few months, by then a 32 bit notebook will have residual value of fifty bucks -- it can't run any of the new 64 bit stuff.

2:44 PM, June 01, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

32 bit has the shelf life of a banana. Vista will be out in just a few months, by then a 32 bit notebook will have residual value of fifty bucks -- it can't run any of the new 64 bit stuff.

this banana will have a extremley long life. even after the time of vista release, 32bit applications will be used for a long, long, long, long time. if we're lucky the usage will decline noticeable in 5 years. but i won't bet on it...

3:47 PM, June 01, 2006  
Blogger Sharikou, Ph. D said...

applications will be used for a long, long, long, long time.

Intel's 32 bit stuff is like a CD-ROM drive. AMD's 64 bit is like a DVD-ROM drive. Yes. The CD-ROm drive can continue to play CDs. But the DVD drive can play both CDs and DVDs. The result, the CD drive worth very little when DVDs are out.

3:59 PM, June 01, 2006  
Anonymous engineer said...

The result, the CD drive worth very little when DVDs are out.

that's the case with each new hardware generation. the price would drop even for 64bit turion processors, when the following (improved & faster) generation would be 32bit. currently there is no need for 64bit on mobile devices... ;)

4:21 PM, June 01, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I see some Turion X2 models have 256K cache per core. These must be cheap for AMD to make.

It makes me wonder if AMD is prepping for a massive price war with Intel.

4:53 PM, June 01, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

MSI released a notebook the monday after the announcement, http://castle.pricewatch.com/s/search.asp?s=Turion+x2 A little one (12.1 wvga)

6:27 PM, June 01, 2006  
Blogger Media Morons said...

u Morons every heard of LINUX - get UBUNTU - support for AMD64 - run the BROWSER of ur choice, i've had it running for a while - as soon as some MORON figures out how to MARKET PACKAGE vs WINDOWS - they're golden ....

... HERE's ur change SUN ...

it goes like this ...

SUN "SCREENS" vs Microsoft WINDOWS .... GET IT!

i've copywrited this so - u owe me - i'll be watching

6:44 PM, June 01, 2006  
Anonymous Jeach! said...

AMD - it's time to lower the prices!

... AMD is prepping for a massive price war with Intel.

Send me some of the stuff you smoke!

Intel won't be able to initially produce enough Conroe processors so they will keep the price high. This will send defectors to AMD which will have strong demand and a reason to maintain prices.

The most important selling period is coming soon (students, etc). If AMD spends alot on marketing I think they can keep the Conroe from being a success.

Vista will be out in just a few months

But remember Sharikou, MS will produce a 32-bit version of Vista also.

if we're lucky the usage will decline noticeable in 5 years.

That's what was said when the transition was made from 16-bit to 32-bit. To everyones surprise it was extremely quick.

Sure 32-bit apps will be around for a long time. But I believe that almost ALL apps will be developed in 64-bit within 18 months.

This fast pace is in part due to the acceptance of 4th generation programming languages. An example is Java and .NET which rely on Virtual Machines (VM). Port your VM (as Microsoft/Sun have done) and ALL software are now 64-bit without even really knowing your coding 64-bit apps.

8:31 PM, June 01, 2006  
Blogger Sharikou, Ph. D said...

But remember Sharikou, MS will produce a 32-bit version of Vista also.


I know. But 32 bit is like a step child. 64 bit Vista can run 32 bit, not the other way around. Imagine your 64 bit friend gives you an app, and you say "my PC doesn't recognize it as a Windows app"....

9:19 PM, June 01, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

BTW: look at this wall socket PC that can even run off power over ethernet.

this device uses a mips32 based alchemy processor not turion64. isn't it stupid to buy 32bit processors?

10:47 PM, June 01, 2006  
Blogger Sharikou, Ph. D said...

this device uses a mips32 based alchemy processor not turion64. isn't it stupid to buy 32bit processors?


The Jack PC is just a terminal connected to a server. The computing happens on the server, which will be AMD64. This is one of AMD's plans for commercial client.

10:55 PM, June 01, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Linux, Solaris, FreeBSD are 64-bit. They are much faster thanks to AMD64.
That's why in server space Opterons are the best choice for a long time.

Sharikou, I don't agree that 32-bit CPU will be not usable. An average Windows user is not going to install Vista in December. It there some reason to pay extra 100$ if you have XP? NO. 64-bit apps is the future, but the transition will take another 2-3 years.

11:19 PM, June 01, 2006  
Blogger Sharikou, Ph. D said...

Sharikou, I don't agree that 32-bit CPU will be not usable.

I never said that 32 bit is not usable. I said that the residual value of 32 bit is near 0 in just a few months.

11:35 PM, June 01, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"64-bit apps is the future, but the transition will take another 2-3 years."
i would say in 1 year. in the short run, normal labtop user will stick with XP and 32bit apps for another half a year or so, unless there is a definate reason for them to upgrade to 64bit.

1:26 AM, June 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I said that the residual value of 32 bit is near 0 in just a few months.

64bit is just a feature like pacifica/vanderpool. so to argue with your words

the residual value of processors without pacifica/vanderpool is near 0 in just a few months.

that's absolutly true because there won't be any new processor generation without this (in many cases useless) feature...

2:01 AM, June 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"The world's only dual core 64 bit technology"

Well, the IBM PPC970MP is on sale since 10/2005 by Apple and others. It's a 64 Bit processor and a low power version is available.

2:39 AM, June 02, 2006  
Blogger zsm said...

HP doesn't have the Pavilion dv2000z notebooks in stock, but they are taking orders. There is a difference.

I checked the HP website, and they are simply taking orders for the new dv2000z notebooks with the Turion X2, not shipping them. Same goes for their sister X2 notebook, the Compaq Presario V3000z. Only when you configure one will you find out that the X2 notebooks won't be shipping out of HP's plants in China until June 27.

P.S.: A 64-bit notebook is a cool idea IMO, but given AMD's poor showings with the previous Turion performance-wise (especially in performance per watt), I'll just wait for either Core 2 Duo/Merom. Or, better yet, I'll probably wait for the next-gen Turion replacement coming out in 2007. Given AMD's mumblings about the new chip, it might be the Core-killer that we're all waiting for.

7:42 AM, June 02, 2006  
Anonymous Aleksandar said...

People buy Intel-based notebooks because now they are far better than anything AMD-based. It is irelevant what will come up in the future (especially because Vista will offer nothing impressive above XP) - what matters is now.

Laptops are far more than just chips. Your blog is a fun read, but here and there totally devoid of common sense.

11:38 AM, June 02, 2006  
Anonymous Edward said...

"People buy Intel-based notebooks because now they are far better than anything AMD-based."

No. People buy Intel-based notebooks because they are highly advertised. Pentium-M is no way better than Turion64 for its price.

What you're saying here exactly reflects the public conception, which is totally distorted by Intel's marketing tactics.

My $1050 Turion64 notebook outperforms my friend's $1800 IBM Centrino. He could've bought a $2500 model which outperforms mine, but he won't. I won't, either, and I feel thankful that I'm not affected by Intel's "Centrino" marketing.

Intel with it's 5x higher capacity can easily sell enough of these very high-end products and still justify its overhead cost (branding, labeling, marketing, customer service). AMD on the other hand cannot afford to have products that have low yields. We will see the same thing on servers and desktops after Woodcrest and Conroe are out; Intel will have the absolute highest performing chips, but AMD will offer better performance/price (right now Intel's p4-based servers and desktops are literally jokes).

So stop saying the BS that P-M is "far better than" anything. They really aren't when you factor their unit cost into the equation.

3:51 PM, June 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

AMD "Raiden" -> JackPC


The Jack PC thin client fits into a wall socket and is so energy-efficient it can get its power over Ethernet

UK firm to unveil wall-socket PC

4:53 PM, June 02, 2006  
Blogger Mad Mod Mike said...

I am really getting annoyed hearing people say "The Pentium M is far superior to K8" when even XtremeSystems, the haven for Intel fanboys, proved this incorrect. The Pentium M with its 10-Stage Pipeline vs. 12 in the K8 is the reason for it performing anywhere near the K8, if it had a 31-stage pipe, it would be in the same pool as the P4, which just as ed said, is a joke at best.

The Pentium M platform costs at least 25% above a equivalent Turion 64 platform, simply because the partners selling it and Intel are charging too much. Intel invented this "performance per watt" marketing, and ever since they spoke the first words, AMD has held the crown and will continue to do so forever it appears.

6:32 PM, June 02, 2006  
Blogger Sharikou, Ph. D said...

The Pentium M is far superior to K8"

Who are such nuts?
Pentium-M is 32 bit. I won't pay 1 dime for it. Anyone bought it must be retarded.

I heard Intel engineers are using Opteron workstations to design their next gen procs.

9:10 PM, June 02, 2006  
Anonymous Aleksandar said...

"So stop saying the BS that P-M is "far better than" anything. They really aren't when you factor their unit cost into the equation."

BS is when you neglect the current star of laptop market - Core Duo 1.83GHz. Pentium-M is history.

What I had in mind is that Centrino Duo is better now than AMD platform (not just CPUs). Will be better for quite some time now, for sure.

I really like AMD (in 10 years of desktop comps I changed 6 CPUs, last 3 + 2nd one were AMD), but when I get my wallet out, I use common sense, not my heart.
Core Duo is the way to go now and will be good buy for at least 1 year. More than enough time for me.

What AMD really needs to do to succeed in laptop market is to win over high-level manufacturers like Sony, Samsung, LG, IBM, Apple, Acer. And by win-over, I mean really win - right now they are all offering (if at all) only low-level product lines with AMD. Not where money is.

6:40 AM, June 03, 2006  
Blogger Mad Mod Mike said...

"What I had in mind is that Centrino Duo is better now than AMD platform (not just CPUs). Will be better for quite some time now, for sure." - Quoted right from Paulie I bet.

Centrino Duo is a gimmick mock developed by Intel, all Centrino REALLY means, is a Pentium M and wireless capability...oooo, how special is that! Centrino does not offer the best performance or performance per watt if you factor in price, most Centrino Duo platforms can easily reach well over $1,000, and most vendors offer $1,200-$1,400 for anything respectable.

A Turion platform can be had for $999 from even Newegg.com that will beat any of those Centrino's in performance per watt and power consumption/price. Centrino is as real as ViiV.

10:06 AM, June 03, 2006  
Anonymous Edward said...

"BS is when you neglect the current star of laptop market - Core Duo 1.83GHz. Pentium-M is history."

And where's anything to prove this point? Core Duo (Yonah) is just a dual-core P-M with large shared L2 cache @65nm. Compared to T64 X2, its biggest advantage is maybe 25% power consumption UNDER LOAD. This is excluding the northbridge, mind you.

I'd be glad if you prove me wrong by showing some favorable benchmark (which BTW shouldn't fit completely into the L2 cache) of Core Duo against T64 X2. BTW, Core Duo laptops are generally more expensive, too. ;)


"What I had in mind is that Centrino Duo is better now than AMD platform (not just CPUs). Will be better for quite some time now, for sure."

That's funny argument, because the "platform" is mainly affected by the marketing money, and you're really proving my points that people (customers or OEMs) find Core Duo better mostly because of Intel's marketing strength.

10:53 AM, June 03, 2006  
Anonymous Aleksandar said...

That's funny argument, because the "platform" is mainly affected by the marketing money, and you're really proving my points that people (customers or OEMs) find Core Duo better mostly because of Intel's marketing strength.

Platform is the selling point here. This blog is all about Intel loosing money of this or that because it's way behind in technology. Well, this has not happened over night - Opteron came on top and stayed on top for, now we can say years.

It's funny to read all this techie arguments you throw at me (which I know, btw) and neglect to see the last sentence in my previous comment: AMD in laptops is non-existent. Now. Yes, there are offers here and there, but the only respected manufacturer offering them in the high-class is Acer (even with Acer top model is Core Duo based). Rest is entry level models, not where money is made. AMD shines in servers, it is very good in desktop and I expect laptop market will follow suit, but not for another year.

I expect HP to be the first to offer AMD in their flagship laptops, followed by Toshiba. Final win will be when Sony goes over to AMD. And if Apple ever goes AMD that will surely mean that Intel is dead. :)
For that to happen, AMD needs to have Opteron-like* contender in the laptop market and it needs to be much better for 1 to 1.5year before this happen en masse.

* - "like" as in as much better than Intel offering as Opteron is now better than anything Intel has.

8:02 AM, June 04, 2006  
Anonymous Edward said...

"AMD in laptops is non-existent."

Agree, and I feel sad, because technically Turion isn't less than P-M, and X2 won't be less than Core Duo.

The "platform"... right. They also say Starbucks sells coffee the best - the atmosphere, this and that. But you know it doesn't have the best coffee in town, don't you?

11:53 PM, June 04, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sharikou:
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20060605-6992.html

Samsung wants to use AMD for the ORIGAMI/UMPCs.

7:07 AM, June 06, 2006  

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