Thursday, November 02, 2006

DELL AMD Notebooks Vista Premium Capable

See here, all DELL AMD Notebooks are capable of Windows Vista Premium Edition.

Intel ones? Sorry, you are out of luck, see here (no Vista support at all), here(no Vista Premium support), here (no mentioning of Vista Premium). A reader provided this wonderful link, which showed most Intel notebooks may not support Aero interface.

INQ thinks Intel has to cut price to clear inventory. It is naive thinking. Usually, companies would rather sent their products to the landfill in order to make profit. The market size is fixed. The only way to make money is by charging higher prices.

Intel's price cut was designed to stop AMD, but that plan has failed already. As AMD gains more and more share, Intel will have to raise prices, or it will BK even faster.

39 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

More FUD from the DR. Here are the requirements for Vista ready and Vista Premium ready from Dell. Here is a quote directly from Dell which should end this silly discussion: "As of June 1, 2006, all newly launching Dell PCs configured with a minimum of 512 MB of RAM qualify as Vista Capable. "

http://www.dell.com/content/topics/global.aspx/solutions/en/vista_capable?c=us&l=en&s=gen

A Windows Vista Premium Ready1 PC includes at least: 1 GHz 32-bit (x86) or 64-bit (x64) processor.
1 GB of system memory2 (note: Dell recommends dual channel memory)
Support for DirectX 9 graphics with a WDDM driver, 128 MB of graphics memory (minimum)3, Pixel Shader 2.0 and 32 bits per pixel.
40 GB of hard drive capacity with 15 GB free space.
DVD-ROM Drive4.
Audio output capability.
Internet access capability.


What is a Windows Vista Capable1 PC?
As of June 1, 2006, all newly launching Dell PCs configured with a minimum of 512 MB of RAM qualify as Vista Capable1.

A Windows Vista Capable1 PC includes at least: A modern processor (at least 800MHz).
512 MB of system memory.
A graphics processor that is DirectX 9 capable.
All Dimension/Inspiron and XPS systems must also ship with a DVD Readable Drive.

9:18 AM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

If your going to post something like that, why not just put the link to what systems are Vista ready?

http://www.dell.com/content/topics/global.aspx/solutions/en/vista_pcs?c=us&cs=&l=en&s=gen

9:23 AM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous PENIX said...

If Intel fails to deliver product which is Vista capable, they will be forced to default. AMD will take nearly 100% market share of the next generation of computers built to run Vista.

This is a critical blow to Intel. Without next generation support, their market share will plummet with the release of Windows Vista. Game over.

9:28 AM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

http://www.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/inspn_e1705?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs

Occording to dell all intel notebooks are vista ready. You just linked to the one page that doesn't mention it.

You are becoming more of a joke everyday.

9:34 AM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Let me see if I’ve got this right. TI & Intel have a glut of chip and AMD is selling every thing it can make. Intel is not supporting Vista with what it has on tap. This is a no-brainer.

I suspect Intel needs to publish those SuperPi bench marks again and turn this fiasco around, this is an outrage. Intel fanboys “here is your sign”.

9:44 AM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sharikou,

I have some background in the semiconductor industry, but am not educated to the extent that you and others purport to be. As such, I am eager to learn more. I started looking at your site as a way to do this. However, when you make claims without any facts, it makes your claims wholly unsubstantiated. When you continue to do this, people no longer believe you. It should be no surprise that you have virtually no credibility. Instead of spouting off like a dog with rabies, why don't you provide some facts (with sources would be even better) that back up your claims. By doing so, the entire community becomes more enriched as we debate the facts. If you don't have the facts, please do us all a favor and just shut down your site. Since I believe you have some of the facts on your side, please share them with us.

While I am not a semiconductor expert, I am, by my education and industry certifications, a financial expert. As such, I can say that most of your financial claims are completely without merit. Let's take the case of your 11/2 9 am post where you state:

"INQ thinks Intel has to cut price to clear inventory. It is naive thinking. Usually, companies would rather sent their products to the landfill in order to make profit."

This is the most absurd statement I have heard in a while, a 6th grader can understand this. The relevant concept is "sunk cost". Once a product is made, the cost is incurred. By not selling it, you can't make any revenue. Why someone would scrap a product is beyond me. Apparently it isn't beyond you. I can imagine you might claim that Intel makes a profit by scrapping a product rather than selling because than they wouldn't incur the really low gross margin for a poorly selling product. However, even though a company generates a lower gross "margin", it might be generating a high gross "profit", which ultimately leads to higher earnings. To say that scrapping a product is better than selling it is just plain stupid.

Statement #2: "The market size is fixed. The only way to make money is by charging higher prices."

There is a economic concept called elasticity of demand, which hypothesizes that a change in price drives a certain change in quantity demanded. A market is deemed to be elastic if small change in price yields a large change in demand. An inelastic market indicates that there is no change in demand for a change in price. While the PC market may not be as elastic as it used to be, there will always be some elasticity. I believe I can make this claim because if there were $50 PCs, many people in poorer countries could afford one, and probably would. That would drive higher unit volume. These comments refer simply to sales, but companies wish to optimize earnings, not sales. So it certainly doesn't make sense to price a PC at $50 when it costs $200 to make. So your argument could make sense if you can supply your assumptions for elasticity of demand and the cost basis for different products. Since you don't, your argument is just a bunch of blather. Provide some numbers behind your arguments or just keep quiet and let others who actually have an understanding of economics and finance figure it out.

Your previous claims about Intel going bankrupt are the icing on the cake. I don't even have to run the numbers to know that Intel isn't going BK by 2Q08. Saying so implies that Intel isn't going to modulate their plans, even if their financial situation declines to the point where cash is a concern. Cash isn't a concern, nor will it be anytime soon. Suggesting that it will go BK proves that you are at least one of: A) a blathering idiot or B) a hypster of the first order.

Go back to providing some real analysis on the products of these two companies and please stop with the idiot rantings on the financial outcomes of such situations.

10:16 AM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I did not see any thing in the link that would assure me that AMD based notebooks are vista premium capable. The disclaimer mentioned that not all vista configurations have been tested.

The intel related links are useful. You make a lot sense except for your obsession with BK.

10:22 AM, November 02, 2006  
Blogger Sharikou, Ph. D said...

Occording to dell all intel notebooks are vista ready. You just linked to the one page that doesn't mention it

Even an old PC can run Vista in the old ugly way, as long as it doesn't use the fancy features. The key is whether a PC is Vista premium ready.

10:32 AM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

My Core 2 Duo Specs:

E6600 2.4ghz
1gig ram
250gig hd
nvidia 7900gs gfx card 256mb
dvd-/+rw dl

runs vista like butter.

Total cost: $967(s/h included)

beats similarly configured FX62 by 5-10% in most tests

10:48 AM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous PENIX said...

anonymous said...

I did not see any thing in the link that would assure me that AMD based notebooks are vista premium capable.

Take a closer look. This text is taken directly from the link Sharikou provided:

the Inspiron 1501 is also Premium Ready to help you take advantage of the 3D Aero capabilities of the next generation Microsoft® operating system, Windows® Vista.

11:05 AM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous PENIX said...

anonymous said...

However, even though a company generates a lower gross "margin", it might be generating a high gross "profit", which ultimately leads to higher earnings. To say that scrapping a product is better than selling it is just plain stupid.

You base all your reasoning on the unfounded assumption that it "might be generating a high gross profit". Then you are so bold as to call the opposition "stupid", yet you make the comment anonymously. You sir, are a coward.

11:12 AM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Even an old PC can run Vista in the old ugly way, as long as it doesn't use the fancy features. The key is whether a PC is Vista premium ready.


This link shows that all intel based laptops from dell are vista premium ready except for the models that only allow 256mb ram.

http://www.dell.com/content/topics/global.aspx/solutions/en/vista_pcs?c=us&cs=&l=en&s=gen

11:26 AM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

2 Based on currently available information from Microsoft. Requirements subject to change. Windows Vista has not been tested on all user configurations, and may not be compatible with some hardware devices and other software. Dell systems must be configured with a minimum of 512MB system memory (RAM) for "Windows Vista Capable" designation. Systems which meet only minimum requirements for the "Windows Vista Capable" designation will not provide the full benefits of "Premium Ready," including the Aero interface. Some Dell systems may not meet the requirements for "Premium Ready," no matter the configuration. Aero and other premium benefits not available with Windows Vista Home Basic. Please visit www.windowsvista.com/getready for more information.
Idiot.

12:19 PM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"The key is whether a PC is Vista premium ready"

Vista premium should not be the only version with that bloated and recource hungtry GUI.

Btw, if you compare two PC's, one running old and ugly looking Vista and the other with the new and fancy then what performs better? For simplicity sake lets assume identical PC's.

12:29 PM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous The Sheepshagger said...

Sharikou --

I happened to note that the link you supplied for the Intel laptops that aren't able to support Vista are for very basic systems (as evidenced by the Dell's page nomenclature on the URL you provided).

Since you are clearly interested in ownership of Vista capable Intel cheap, I've found you the link you will need to purchase as many as you need.

-CLICK ME-

One thing to note that is all inclusivie for all AMD and Intel notebooks is the following cavaet Dell has provided with hyperlink notation marks "5" and "7" which read in full as follows below (and also provide at the bottom of the screen for your perusal at -this link-):

"5 Based on currently available information from Microsoft. Requirements subject to change. Since the operating system and drivers are not final at this time, Windows Vista™ has not been tested on all user configurations. Only systems with sufficient graphics and memory will meet Microsoft's requirements for running the Premium interface. Those which meet only minimum requirements for the Vista Capable designation will not provide the full benefits of Premium. Please visit http://www.microsoft.com/technet/windowsvista/evaluate/hardware/vistarpc.mspx for more information."

"7 Based on currently available information from Microsoft. Requirements are subject to change. Since the operating system and drivers are not final at this time, Windows Vista has not been tested on all user configurations. Please visit http://www.microsoft.com/technet/windowsvista/evaluate/hardware/vistarpc.mspx for more information."

Warm Regards

1:19 PM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

FUDDDDDDDDDDD!!!!!!!!!!!!! QUIT SPREADING FUDDDDDDDDDDDDDD!!!!!!!

1:27 PM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

setup 10 Intel core 2400 (2x 1.8 ghz) laptops t-day man are they slow or something..all preloaded from toshiba!

they may scream on benchmarks etc but they seam to pause pause pause when doing standard web browsing file stuff... driving users insane?? maybe bad batch?


in contrast the 2 turion t50 x 2
1.6ghz seem happy and snappy as clams go figure?

3:34 PM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I have been reading this blog for a while and I have come to the conclusion that Sharikou must be on the AMD payroll. It is the only thing that explains the FUD. Read with a grain of salt.
That been said, Go AMD Go!

4:43 PM, November 02, 2006  
Blogger Jeach! said...

To the first blogger...

Obviously people are going to want Vista regardless of the PC they buy, which is why DELL will market anything you want to see.

Do you actually believe that Vista can run 'reasonably' on only 512MB of RAM and/or 800MHz processor and/or in 32-bit?

When an OS is built from the ground up to be 64-bit, but then is compiled and deployed in 32-bit for a 32-bit chip, you can gurantee its going to affect your whole PC performance!

5:31 PM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Some guy said " have some background in the semiconductor industry, but am not educated to the extent that ...." and on and on.

DUDE get with it.. Sharikou PhD has no expertise in anything. He is unemployable as a technologist. Look only at his battery and bench mark claims and his BK claims..

I can't believe you wasted your time to type and type and type.. You are not an expertise in the most important thing COMMON SENSE!

5:51 PM, November 02, 2006  
Blogger Jeach! said...

All of you people who proclaim themselves financial experts but can't even rationalize a bit of information.

Take this for example! Most of my friends have MBA's.

I like to have fun with them and ask them questions like:

Company A: Has been loosing $20 million per year for the last 5 years. They are depleted of all cash, product sucks. After shutting down all operations, liquidating all assets and paying their liabilities they are left with exactly $1 to their name.

Company B: Is 'extremely' successfull, profitable and is sitting on a huge pile of cash. This company never looked so good!

1. What is company A worth to B?
2. Should company B buy A?
3. If so, how much should they pay?

99% of the time, my MBA friends will answer:

1. Nothing
2. No (or are you f!@#$ crazy)
3. Get it for free

Turns out these financial experts see 'FACTS' (a BK'd company) and can't rationalize around it.

The truth is company A is worth around $50 to $80 millilon. That's because if company B buys it, they can use their past losses against future profits.

Now take that analogy and apply it to all the FACTS you seem to know about Intel.

5:56 PM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sumarisation of all the comments thus far: All Dell notebooks with 512mb ram or more are Vista ready. Sharkiou is the FUD king.

Of course, people who want best performance in Vista will choose a Core 2 based system. No one wants AMD's ancient junk.

7:15 PM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I cannot believe i'm posting this but here:

http://www.dell.com/content/topics/global.aspx/solutions/en/vista_pcs?c=us&l=en&s=gen

Has a full chart of what intel/amd systems support Vista basic and what configurations (ie: 1gm of ram and/or a video card with dedicated ram) support Aero.

7:17 PM, November 02, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why don't any of you intel fanboi tw*ts get the difference between vista ready and vista premium ready??!!! Right through the whole of the responses you keep saying "its vista ready!!" yeah we know! The point is, is it premium ready? jeesuz.

2:19 AM, November 03, 2006  
Anonymous roborat said...

OOPS KENTSFIELD IS OUT!

AMD once again goes down another level in performance. AMD's products are becoming a joke.
I'm sure AMD will do well in their new low end niche market competing with Pentium4's.

Surely, this mean bankrupcy for Intel!!

4:37 AM, November 03, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"OOPS KENTSFIELD IS OUT!"

Well, actually it was only announced. It will be out around 18'th

7:28 AM, November 03, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Shark,
Mort Toppfer, ex of dell, now on AMD board bought 100,000 shares of AMD.

http://knobias.10kwizard.com/filing.php?repo=tenk&ipage=4461961&doc=1&total=&back=2&g=&attach=on

9:10 AM, November 03, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Kentsfield is a pit stop for Intel to get a bet on why AMD is still gaining market share and Intel loosing. And it is certainly a double-edge sword killing part of the super-top-end Core2 Duo sales. While it quad core stunts done by reviewer looks good, I think it would be a short lived product sustaining the arrival of 45nm quad core which I think will have the power envelop of Duo while having quad core. This will be Intel main focus next year on. AMD 4x4, K8L will be competing with Intel high-end offerings.

From the looks of it, right now no doubt Intel will conquer high-end desktop and low-end server sales. And AMD will conquer the remaining. And in between having a balanced price/performance battle X2 4400 vs E6300 which I think they tie in desktop (both are good IMHO). Pentium4 and Celeron will be left for the remaining (corporate) noob to take.

Intel will be still the leader in notebook while slowly loosing share to Turion X2.

Some non-phd maths (my own estimate) exiting 2006:
Intel share: 70%
AMD share: 30%
C2D production: 30%

The remaing Netburst's share: 49% (70% of 70%) of the market will be taken over by AMD faster than Intel foresee. So there is a possibility that AMD could reach 35%~40% between the end of 2006 and 1Q2007 provided AMD could ramp up productions.

Anyway any smart IT people would know that 800MHz processor and 512MB of RAM with a shared-memory graphics wouldn't run Vista Basic in harmony. Heck even with this spec XP (all visual turned off) is choking.

11:37 AM, November 03, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Why don't any of you intel fanboi tw*ts get the difference between vista ready and vista premium ready??!!! Right through the whole of the responses you keep saying "its vista ready!!" yeah we know! The point is, is it premium ready? jeesuz.

Oh, we get it - you have a sub-par intellect. Someone posted a link to Dell indicating exactly which machines are Aero/Permium ready, and almost all of their machines are.

You people are just a bunch of ridiculous human beings.

12:27 PM, November 03, 2006  
Blogger enumae said...

Anonymous said...

"The remaing Netburst's share: 49% (70% of 70%) of the market will be taken over by AMD faster than Intel foresee. So there is a possibility that AMD could reach 35%~40% between the end of 2006 and 1Q2007 provided AMD could ramp up productions."

Sorry but no possibility...

Hector Ruiz has stated that ...predicted 35% growth in production next year over this.

23.3% (current market share and considering they sell everything they make) * 1.35 (35% increase in capcity) = 31.455% to be about the maximum market share they could sustain (capacity wise) this time next year, and after that there isn't much room to grow.

The transition to 45nm will be middle to late 2008, so no products until about early 2009.

New York FAB probably won't be done until 2010 / 2011.

Market share will stall, and if Intel decides to go Quadcore on most server chips and high end desktops leaving 2008 (my opinion) AMD will be in some serious trouble. AMD will not have the capacity to compete with Intel considering Intel has 4 65nm FABS and 3 45nm FABS in the works...

Imagine early 2009 you could buy an Intel Quad core for $500, or buy an AMD dual core for $500, if both cores are very close performance wise which would you choose, its simple, Quad core, and who knows maybe by then software for gaming and day to day programs will be heavily threaded... :)

5:25 PM, November 03, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

A monkey said "You people are just a bunch of ridiculous human beings."

So impress me, I'm waiting. Oh I do know the difference between your Ass and our mouth. YOu talk out of your Ass.

Can you please say something intelligent now!

6:23 PM, November 03, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sharikou PhD... how come you won't put money on your BK prediction?

Want to tell us your bet or why you aren't willing to bet on it..

Or for that matter any claim you make here

6:24 PM, November 03, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Even an old PC can run Vista in the old ugly way, as long as it doesn't use the fancy features. The key is whether a PC is Vista premium ready."

And what percentage of laptops in 2007 will have Vista? 100%? 50%? <20%?

8:30 PM, November 03, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

ALL Dell notebooks you say?
Do you mean that single mega-slow and expensive cheapo thing that gets spanked by all the other Intel notebook before it even has booted to Windoze?

3:05 AM, November 04, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Like what Scientia mentioned in his blogs.. there is an absurd amount of bias when reporting news regarding AMD and Intel.

Most tend to be more forgiving of Intel.. for under-delivering, vaporware releases, cancellations etc, but the same group will hound AMD for just a minor delay or for similar infractions.

I guess it is no wonder then that AMD chooses not to over-promise or over-hype their products.

But customers who have seen the upcoming stuff under NDA are still buying more AMD gear, so I guess it isn't as dismal an outlook as some Intellers like to believe.

Enumae,

In 2009, both AMD and Intel should have 45nm based quad cores in the mainstream for servers and desktops, and I do not see why they would be 500 bucks, or why AMD would only still have X2s in the mainstream.

If anything, based on track records, with X2s taking on the single core pricing, I would expect a quick ramp up and transition where X2s (with improved IPC cores from Barcelona - similar improvements that Intel did from Core to Core 2) take value segment against Core 2 while the X4s (or whatever they call it) take the mainstream against the native quads from Intel (aka not Clovertown/Kentsfield MCM pseudo quads). If anything, X4s would have been around for 2 years, while the Intel native quad would still be a fairly new entrant (1 yr).

6:42 AM, November 04, 2006  
Blogger enumae said...

Anonymous said...

"In 2009, both AMD and Intel should have 45nm based quad cores in the mainstream for servers and desktops, and I do not see why they would be 500 bucks, or why AMD would only still have X2s in the mainstream."

My whole point was capacity wise AMD could not go all quad cores for server and high end desktop in early 2009.

They are capacity constrained now and we are only on dual cores, like I said there is only so much capacity that can fit in there 2 FABS.

As for X2's, I did not mention them.

7:21 PM, November 04, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

enumae said:
"Imagine early 2009 you could buy an Intel Quad core for $500, or buy an AMD dual core for $500"

Err, you were the one who mentioned the X2 in 2009.

AMD has demonstrated the ability to ramp up from single cores to X2s when switching from 130nm to 90nm. Expect the 65nm switch to provide the same transition to quads easily. And with 45nm on track (much smaller lead if at all on Intel's side), and a second FAB with 300mm wafers, I do not see AMD having capacity constraints.

Intel would on the other hand requires a completely new single die quadcore in 2008.

6:40 PM, November 05, 2006  
Anonymous enumae said...

Anonymous said...

"Err, you were the one who mentioned the X2 in 2009."

I said dual core, I did not mean for you to take it as X2 or to come across as X2, I was just trying to show a comparison in manufacturing capacity in 2009 of quad core to dual core.

"...Expect the 65nm switch to provide the same transition to quads easily. And with 45nm on track (much smaller lead if at all on Intel's side), and a second FAB with 300mm wafers, I do not see AMD having capacity constraints."

They will have capacity constraints due to rising market share, if there market share stays the same then capacity should be fine, the original point of mine is that capacity will limit market share gains for AMD until the NY FAB is complete, around 2010.

Also factor in about 10% growth every year in the processor market, and AMD's need to begin making there own chipset, integrated graphics and then there high end graphics.

Market share gains will slow drastically the end of next year.

Also Intel is scheduled for 45nm Q3-Q4 07, AMD is not until Q3-Q4 08, so about a year later.

"Intel would on the other hand requires a completely new single die quadcore in 2008."

Yes they will, but the dual die on an MCM is cheaper and has better yields, so until they have an IMC and CSI it probably won't help to be on a single die to much anyways.

1:16 PM, November 06, 2006  
Blogger The_Physicist said...

Personally I don't see how cutting cost can potentially decrease their sales. It can in some cases increase their revenue and their profits, however much that sounds silly, thats how microeconomics works. Personally from my perspective it seems to be a good idea, it can allow them to sell more units and make more money. This all depends on how their productions possiblities curve looks. We will see how it pays off. Also I really don't understand what you are saying. If it says vista capable does it mean all vista versions, or just some. I'm not sure if it is entirely understood what they mean. I also checked the dell website. They don't even advertise the E1501 to be vista capable with a turion 64 X2. They also don't adverties the latitude 131 series to be vista capable. Do you think it could be more video card reliant. Just putting some thoughts out there. I don't think its the chip so much as the video card's capability to handle aero. Both chips are damned good so I think it is the other hardware. Also the basic ones pointed out in the post all have older technology, i.e. pentium M's and integrated GMA 950's I believe so that puts them out to begin with.

12:12 AM, November 10, 2006  

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